Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
The context for what I'm saying is 1.3% is not far from the failure rate for the engine regardless of where it is ...if it's 15% in SA then scaled up to world levels it would equate to 30,000 engines. Where is the evidence to show the issue is any worse in SA than anywhere else?21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
22nd Dec 2016 10:22 pm
Deanos_Beano
Member Since: 21 Feb 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 563
No idea , im only concerened with LR stating 1.3 % in SA
It then got a little blurred when you alledged that Naks stated 15% would equate to 30000 , anything else is official as linked previously , im just trying to establish where the percieved whitenoise is coming from
Afterall 1.3% is a serious problem for a single point of failure and not insignificant nor as you have eluded to , the industry norm .
22nd Dec 2016 10:48 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
Ah ok read the article ... all seems pretty straightforward and insignificant to me 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
22nd Dec 2016 11:09 pm
Deanos_Beano
Member Since: 21 Feb 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 563
Yeah that was my original concern with your devils advocate approach , I thought it rather flawed considering the people on here alone that are 16k down and no car , thought personally that 1.3% for a single point of failure was a bit high and costly myself
22nd Dec 2016 11:13 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
Why is it flawed? 1.38% or 1 in 72 is the known engine failure rate for LR ...so nothing to be surprised about and more than likely the figure being quoted in that article.
I have already stated that my complete sympathy for individuals affected is a given ...and that LR should be doing more for them. All I wish to do is offer a perspective to other site users rather than them worrying that there is some massive problem when clearly there isn't.21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
22nd Dec 2016 11:43 pm
tayaste
Member Since: 15 May 2013
Location: Chester
Posts: 7633
1 in 72 engine failure rate .. Nothing to be surprised about
I am shocked to think that figure is acceptable, I know it isn't acceptable for the company I work for.
22nd Dec 2016 11:47 pm
tayaste
Member Since: 15 May 2013
Location: Chester
Posts: 7633
Also, I believe that figure was from 2013. I'd like to see the data now for 2016
22nd Dec 2016 11:53 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
tayaste wrote:
1 in 72 engine failure rate .. Nothing to be surprised about
Considering that places them in the 10 'best'....you should perhaps be more shocked at other leading marques that feature in the 10 'worst' 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
23rd Dec 2016 12:01 am
tayaste
Member Since: 15 May 2013
Location: Chester
Posts: 7633
At number 10. I'd like to see 2016 data,
23rd Dec 2016 12:05 am
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
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Wouldn't we all 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
23rd Dec 2016 12:10 am
Deanos_Beano
Member Since: 21 Feb 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 563
DG wrote:
Why is it flawed? 1.38% or 1 in 72 is the known engine failure rate for LR ...so nothing to be surprised about and more than likely the figure being quoted in that article.
I have already stated that my complete sympathy for individuals affected is a given ...and that LR should be doing more for them. All I wish to do is offer a perspective to other site users rather than them worrying that there is some massive problem when clearly there isn't.
Because they all failed from the same thing and its rising, not sure you get the fact these are all crankshaft failures of the same nature is the point , not the general failure of an engine .
From your own data your saying that 2600 crank failures is acceptable ?
23rd Dec 2016 7:28 am
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
I get it more than you think Most engine failures are to a pattern ..what isn't definable is why because it's not consistent nor wholly identifiable at the point of production. I'm not saying that any number of engine failures are acceptable, what I am saying is that those are the numbers that can be anticipated and the rate of failure which includes those for crank are within a normal range across all manufacturers.
Where's your evidence and data that the numbers are rising btw? ...and whats the %age v overall sales 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
23rd Dec 2016 8:18 am
Robse
Member Since: 10 Jun 2014
Location: Cambridgeshire
Posts: 498
Is this issue a particular age/year of disco or is it still happening ?Velar MY18 D180 S Narvik
Discovery MY2015 3.0 SDV6 SE Corris - Gone
23rd Dec 2016 9:37 am
Deanos_Beano
Member Since: 21 Feb 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 563
DG wrote:
I get it more than you think Most engine failures are to a pattern ..what isn't definable is why because it's not consistent nor wholly identifiable at the point of production. I'm not saying that any number of engine failures are acceptable, what I am saying is that those are the numbers that can be anticipated and the rate of failure which includes those for crank are within a normal range across all manufacturers.
Where's your evidence and data that the numbers are rising btw? ...and whats the %age v overall sales
The article was last year and the crank failure posts on here and the other sites are this month and this year , or do you not accept this as contributory evidence ?
Im not fully aware of what you know thats correct and my limited knowlege of 4 years at HGV college and plant fitting many years ago doesnt qualify me either especially as i drive tractors and mowers for a living more than fix engines these days .but I am the owner of a D4 with worries
However if we try not to digress or detract , the point is this , would other manufacturers consider this frequency a recall event or a worry given the commonality , the answer is a resounding yes .
Would the failure of an engine generically at thus current percentage warrant it ? Nope
For clarification , you are saying that the current situation is an acceptable situation and not a concern and I dont agree which i think is a nice place to wait for further info .
23rd Dec 2016 9:51 am
DG Site Moderator
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OK that makes it all clear ...thanks 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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Where is the evidence to show the issue is any worse in SA than anywhere else?
... all seems pretty straightforward and insignificant to me 
1.38% or 1 in 72 is the known engine failure rate for LR ...so nothing to be surprised about and more than likely the figure being quoted in that article.
