al cope wrote:

And privatisation isn't always the answer, as in this case there shouldn't be any profit going to shareholders, it should all be going on patient care.

It's a nice thought, but if you give shareholders a profit and in the end get a better service than you otherwise would for doing so, then that is still better. That's not to say it's easily done, but in principle, it's still fair game. If the NHS is draining huge amounts of value away from patients, then it either ends up in the private sector or in the hands of employees (not literally), who then spend in in the private sector, so...

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Brian_DL13 wrote:

Of course, the elephant in the room here is that NHS staff - at all levels - are, these days, pretty well remunerated (some extremely well remunerated) when you take into account the gold-plated pension and benefits they have. In that context I have to admit that the posturing of the junior doctors annoys me somewhat

PaulJC wrote:

on an actual ambulance and then having to stand in a hospital corridor for 3 hours until the patient can be offloaded...
...

last week I had message that my mother had suffered a mild stroke and was in hospital, worried I tried to find out what happened from Family there; it turned out my older brother happened to be visiting when it started.
they called medical aid, who sent paramedics, and then 2 nurses turned up, and then an ambulance; all with very short time. they gave oxygen and said hospital would be needed for a scan; as they loaded her up the ambulance driver said they would take her to Northampton as Banbury was locked down.
since then I heard the full story that Banbury was so busy the ambulances were queuing in the car park no space inside

for my Mum she was seen straight on arrival in Northampton but I feel sorry for those that were stuck in ambulances.

amazing here in Czech there seems very little wait time and while the outside building may not look much they do have up to date equipment.


(actually when I damaged my inner ear, I was sent to the army medical hospital and one of the test equipment PC was booted up it was running window 95 ; but the test equipment works perfect)

The Dundonian wrote:

The problem was the CT scan. They are in use 24/7, believe it or not. At night there is limited trained staff to operate it. Doesn't matter how quick or slow A&E staff are if the thing holding it all up is the CT scan.

That is true but we had a dedicated personnel available on call for that the problem is that it was not always easy to convince them to come

John C wrote:

I also think (without being too arrogant) that since my student days as a hospital porter and since having run a decent number of successful businesses with varying staff numbers over the last few years I'd have a pretty good idea as to how to run a decent team and organisation.

I've had loads of observations that I tried to get my head around (I've had a lot of time)... the incredible foreign doctors/nurses who are constantly talked down to by other staff... the seemingly time wasteful processes... the comms/reporting... some awful white underclass patients... some arrogant god-like consultants... the lack of empowerment... pressure...

Where I got to was that anyone that thinks they know how to fix it, or who can get their head around such an extraordinarily complex organisation doesn't know what they're talking about (and honestly this isn't directed at any of the previous posters!!!).

I genuinely have no idea what on earth anyone can do to fix it. It is such an extraordinarily complex problem.

I joined the NHS 14 years ago after being self employed or senior manager in the private sector. I had hoped to be part of the solution, after a few years I become involved in Theatres primarily information and systems but also involved in various theatre productivity improvement schemes over the years and I can honestly say we haven't made it worse but sometimes I feel that I have just become part of the problem!

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BLFarrar wrote:

Brian_DL13 wrote:

Of course, the elephant in the room here is that NHS staff - at all levels - are, these days, pretty well remunerated (some extremely well remunerated) when you take into account the gold-plated pension and benefits they have. In that context I have to admit that the posturing of the junior doctors annoys me somewhat

NHS staff aren't that well remunerated - do some asking & some comparisons for graduate & non graduate positions ..... junior doctors range from newly qualified "F1's" right up to just before becoming a consultant ...... that can easily be people well into there late 40's
Remember they have lives outside of work.....mortgages, families & aspirations.....

The "posturing" description isn't to me fair.....the ones who have spoken out have been articulate, accurate & honest in saying it isn't about remuneration totally...it's about patients.

But where else would a contract be imposed that reduced take home pay, increased hours & had built in weekend & night work at no extra premium ?
If you could see my younger daughters roster for a large London teaching hospital you would be amazed at her working week hours....in context a cleaner on the LU gets a higher take home pay.....she has people's lives in her hands.