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christyler
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: Cork, Ireland
Posts: 1168
  
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Very Annoyed wrote:It's all too American!
well i second that, i think it is all a load of bollix. we are just a group of people getting together to do some off roading.
if anyone dosnt want to take the risk with there car or person then dont come.
personally i hate this kind of stuff, i will not be signing any disclamers for events and if that means i cant come then so be it.
Having said that if i damage my car on an event or mangle myself beyond beleif then thats my problem i wont be looking to claim from anyone either.
As far as i am concerned, if you there you are there at your own risk. CLUB "Ah Shor it'll be grand"
First D3 in the World with a Hydraulic Winch.
2006 Disco 3 TDV6 S Auto,
Diff Locks, Turbochipped, Raised Air Intake, 220volts Onboard, Onboard Compressor, Large Bore Exahust, Underbody Protection, One or two Other Mods as well.
Other toys include, Argo Avenger 8x8, Tatra 6x6 Motorhome (Being Built)
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 20th Jun 2007 2:03 pm |
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Alex08
Member Since: 09 Nov 2006
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 1600
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Quote:
Norman will sue Billy and You and possibly the landowner...Billy could also countersue you and the landowner....the landowner could counter sue you Thumbs Up Who are you going to sue chap??
Again, you can't stop the suing - but liability insurance/vehicle damage insurance takes away the worry. Is there anyone on the site who is a broker or can look into this?
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:08 pm |
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Slimer
Site Moderator
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Last Exit to Nowhere
Posts: 16295
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Chris, unfortunately vehicle insurance isn't the main issue here, it's cover for damage/death to other people that really matters The End
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:17 pm |
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blue meanie
D3 Decade
Member Since: 04 Aug 2005
Location: Newbury
Posts: 6861
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surely if you have the correct vehicle insurance that covers you off the standard highway ( which if you're venturing off road you should have anyway? ) then it should cover these sort of 3rd parties anyway? and theeeeennn......???
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:18 pm |
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Slimer
Site Moderator
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Last Exit to Nowhere
Posts: 16295
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Probably but how many have that sort of cover? The End
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:20 pm |
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christyler
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: Cork, Ireland
Posts: 1168
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Slimer wrote:Chris, unfortunately vehicle insurance isn't the main issue here, it's cover for damage/death to other people that really matters
yes i see what you mean, but if there not there then they wont get hurt, and if they are there then they are at there own risk. CLUB "Ah Shor it'll be grand"
First D3 in the World with a Hydraulic Winch.
2006 Disco 3 TDV6 S Auto,
Diff Locks, Turbochipped, Raised Air Intake, 220volts Onboard, Onboard Compressor, Large Bore Exahust, Underbody Protection, One or two Other Mods as well.
Other toys include, Argo Avenger 8x8, Tatra 6x6 Motorhome (Being Built)
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:28 pm |
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Slimer
Site Moderator
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Last Exit to Nowhere
Posts: 16295
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If you can make that stand up in court I'm with you  The End
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:30 pm |
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blue meanie
D3 Decade
Member Since: 04 Aug 2005
Location: Newbury
Posts: 6861
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so ignoring the actual damages to vehicle type worry, if everyone's pootling about anywhere that's a public right of way then you 'should' be covered because basically it's still a 'road'.
if you're on private land that ever has any form of commercial activity going on then the owner 'should' have planning permission, public liability policy etc, no?
it would be interesting to know really wouldn't it because when you think about it, it's no different to having something like a carboot sale on private land or similar, the possibilities for third party injuries aren't really that different? have you seen some of these bargain hunters' driving?!  and theeeeennn......???
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:45 pm |
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catweasel
Member Since: 05 May 2006
Location: Bundaleer
Posts: 4805
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the point initially was to not have any come back on this site and also the organisers of events in case of a mishap and as the site is used to organise events but the site nor the owner actually do the organising need some protection and events organised through this forum should at least comply to a minimum standard as to not ruin the efforts that have gone into previous events. the problem is, while everyone is happy and friends they see no need for this type of discussion until it all goes pear shaped and even the best of friends can end up hating each other. reading and signing a disclaimer is no big deal and even legally binding contracts can be contested, it is just to get some sort of order and culture towards the events section IMO.
also the "if you come it's at your own risk" I feel is not going to help those new and inexperienced to offroading which is what some of the events are aimed at, introductory and non damaging which can then lead to more adventurous jaunts. those experienced remember that you too were once a novice. also these events are family orientated too I believe and others will be present the present another risk. this might be over the top to some but here in OZ we have a saying
'one spark can destroy a park'
it only takes one incident to turn nasty to bring this all to an end and at the end of the day it's not much to ask.
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| 20th Jun 2007 2:51 pm |
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christyler
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: Cork, Ireland
Posts: 1168
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catweasel wrote: also the "if you come it's at your own risk" I feel is not going to help those new and inexperienced to offroading
And it will help to let them think they can blame or sue someone else if they have a mishap ?? CLUB "Ah Shor it'll be grand"
First D3 in the World with a Hydraulic Winch.
2006 Disco 3 TDV6 S Auto,
Diff Locks, Turbochipped, Raised Air Intake, 220volts Onboard, Onboard Compressor, Large Bore Exahust, Underbody Protection, One or two Other Mods as well.
Other toys include, Argo Avenger 8x8, Tatra 6x6 Motorhome (Being Built)
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| 20th Jun 2007 3:19 pm |
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Non Stick Nick
Member Since: 02 Oct 2005
Location: Reading, Berkshire
Posts: 772
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The most efficient way to obtain insurance for event sis to become a club & join the MSA.
I know this is a forum & not a club but if the forum members do organise events I can see that a court of law will look upon the group as a club whether or not it is formalised.
Insurance companies that provide cover for "motor " events are all familiar with the MSA & their regulations ( The BLue Book) so will have many questions to ask.
Below is a copy of the questionaire that you are likely to encounter when seeking insurance for motor events.
Hope it helps !!!
Non Stick
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 1 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
Public Liability Insurance
New Risk Questionnaire
Please complete, sign and return together with the attachments to:
Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited
Lockton House
6 Bevis Marks
London
EC3A 7AF
Tel: +44 (0)20 7933 0000
Fax:+44 (0)20 7933 0939
If you have any questions regarding this form, please contact us either on the telephone number above or by
visiting the Contact Us section at lockton.com/international
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 2 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
IMPORTANT NOTICE REGARDING COMPLETION OF THIS PROPOSAL FORM
1. Disclosure
- Any “material fact†must be disclosed to Insurers.
- A “material fact†is any information, which may alter the judgement of an Insurer in assessing a risk.
- Any “material change†must be disclosed to Insurers.
- A “material change†is any information which may alter the judgement of an Insurer or their
perception of risk and exposure that has not previously been disclosed as a material fact.
(If you are unsure whether a fact or change is material or not, you should disclose it.)
Failure to provide all “material facts†and/or notify all “material changes†may cause the contract of
insurance to be void and may result in Insurers repudiating liability entirely.
2. Presentation
- This Proposal Form must be completed in ink by an authorised individual, a Partner/ Principal/
Member or Director of the Firm.
- All questions must be answered.
- If there is insufficient space to provide answers, additional information should be provided on the
Company’s letter headed paper.
- Where available brochures, standard contract conditions, conditions, agreements and letters of
appointment should be provided.
Failure to present Insurers with information in an appropriate manner may adversely influence the
ability of Insurers to offer terms.
3. Guidance
- If in doubt as to the meaning of any question contained within this proposal form or the issues raised
in (1) or (2) above, please contact an Account Executive at Lockton.
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 3 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
Additional information should be provided on separate sheets (ideally on Company Headed notepaper), clearly
identifiable as forming part of the proposal form.
1. Title of Insured to be:
2. Address
Post Code:
Tel No: Fax:
E-mail: Website:
3. Full Business Description to be insured:
4. Please provide a brief CV outlining previous relevant experience; any qualifications etc:
5. Please provide details of where the insured is affiliated to/approved by/members of:
6. Is this a new venture? YES NO
If ‘NO’, how long has the business been running.
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 4 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
7. Have there been any incidents in the past, which could have given rise to a claim? YES NO
If ‘YES’, please provide details.
8. Will you have exclusive use of the venue at the time of your activity? YES NO
If ‘NO’, please provide details of what other use there is.
9. How will spectators (parents, friends etc) be controlled/confined?
10. Do you allow non-participating spectator attendance? YES NO
If ‘YES’, please provide the approximate numbers per event.
11. How will they be controlled/confined?
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 5 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
12. Will all Aviation activities be suspended during your use of the venue? YES NO
If ‘NO’, please provide details.
13. How precisely will your activity be organised and supervised (to mitigate the risks involved)?
14. What age groups will participate and what restrictions will be applied?
15. What instruction, tuition, advice or maintenance is provided by the insured?
16. What first aid facilities will be provided and by whom?
17. What fire protection facilities will be provided and by whom?
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 6 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
18. What vehicles and equipment will be supplied by the insured?
19. What safety devices (cut-outs, speed restrictions etc) are your vehicles equipped with?
20. What type of helmets are provided? Open face Full face
21. What additional safety equipment do you supply?
Back Protectors Gloves Overalls Full harness Belts
Other
22. Please list each of the activities/services you offer:
23. What percentage of your business involves:
Arrive and drive
Tuition/instruction
Corporate Entertainment
Under 18 years olds
Other (please specify)
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 7 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
24. Will the track /circuit be marshalled enabling total visibility of the whole track/circuit etc at all
times? YES NO
25. Do you have a nominated Safety Officer in attendance? YES NO
26. Are your officials in radio contact? YES NO
27. What is the minimum training/experience of your officials?
28. Who has provided your cover previously and has any insurer declined to renew the policy?
29. Do you require Employers Liability cover? YES NO
If ‘YES’, please advise number of employees and annual estimated wages for the forthcoming
year with a brief note of their duties.
30. What is the anticipated financial turnover during the next 12 months?
31. What is your anticipated number of clients/customers during the next 12 months?
32. How many customers would be in attendance on a typical day?
33. How many staff officials would be required on a typical day?
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 8 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
34. What qualifications or experience are your customers required to have prior to participating?
35. Do you provide catering yourselves? YES NO
36. Is alcohol available to anyone attending your activity? YES NO
If ‘YES’, please provide details.
37. Please advise names of any other insurers/brokers who are providing you with quotations for this risk so that we do not
duplicate an approach to them:
38. Please enclose the following
1. Specimen copies of your advertising material /booking forms etc
2. A copy of your risk assessment you have carried out
3. A simple plan showing your venue, the track and any public rights of way traversing the area of your activity or
immediately adjacent to it
4. Copy rules/regulations applying to your activity
5. A note of your minimum requirements for a suitable venue (maybe a copy that would be issued to a
prospective venue operator/landowner)
6. A note of your planned programme of events/activities during the next year identifying venues to be used.
© Corporate Risk Solutions
A Division of Lockton Companies International Limited.
Authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
A Lloyd’s Broker.
LIM 350 – Nov 06
Page 9 of 9 Website: lockton.com/international
DATA PROTECTION
By signing this proposal form you consent to Lockton using the information we may hold about you for the purpose of
providing insurance and handling claims, if any, and to process sensitive personal data about you where this is necessary
(for example criminal convictions). This may mean we have to give some details to third parties involved in providing
insurance cover. These may include insurance carriers, third-party claims adjusters, fraud detection and prevention
services, reinsurance companies and insurance regulatory authorities. In the course of performing our obligation to you,
this information may be disclosed to agents and service providers appointed by us, insurers, (which includes their reinsurers,
legal advisers, loss adjustors or agents). Where such sensitive personal information relates to anyone other than
you, you must obtain the explicit consent of the person to whom the information relates both to the disclosure of such
information to us and its use by us as set out above. The information provided will be treated in confidence and, where
appropriate, in compliance with the relevant Data Protection legislation. You have the right to apply for a copy of your
information (for which we may charge a small fee) and to have any inaccuracies corrected.
DECLARATION
I/We declare that the above statements and particulars are true, full enquiry having been made, and I/We have not
omitted, suppressed or mis-stated any material facts which may be relevant to Insurers' consideration of this proposal
form and undertake to inform the Insurer of any change to any material fact that occurs prior to the point at which the
insurance contract has been agreed.
I/We understand that the information I/We provide will be used in deciding the price charged by the Insurer for the
risk and whether the Insurer will accept the application and the terms of any policy provided.
PRINT NAME:
SIGNATURE:
ON BEHALF OF:
DATE:
If completing online, please save your form and visit the Contact Us section for details on where to send your completed form.
Please note, if you wish to submit your form via email, an indication of terms and conditions may be provided on the basis of this proposal form. An original
signature is required before a contract of insurance can be made. Encrypted signatures are not acceptable.
Signing this form does not bind the Company to complete the insurance
We recommend that you keep a record of all information supplied to us, including copies of letters and this proposal form, for the purpose of entering into
this contract.
From time to time, we may disclose personal information (other than sensitive personal data) to other Lockton Companies. We or they may use that information to advise you of our
services which may be of interest to you. If you would prefer not to receive information, please contact an Account Executive at Lockton. I am a hob nobber.
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| 20th Jun 2007 3:28 pm |
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SPORTYBUS
Member Since: 20 Jul 2006
Location: Irelande Du Nord
Posts: 204
 
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christyler wrote:Slimer wrote:Chris, unfortunately vehicle insurance isn't the main issue here, it's cover for damage/death to other people that really matters
yes i see what you mean, but if there not there then they wont get hurt, and if they are there then they are at there own risk.
I'm afraid I don't have the same sentiment?
To be at an event as a spectator or taking part for your own enjoyment and some 'buck idiot' acts the wag and runs over one of my children, or AN Other, i'm afraid Mr Idiot (and who ever else is accountable) WILL be sued for the death or injury! It is not an excuse to purely walk away and say "you shouldn't have been there, when I drove over you!"
Please excuse the 'rant' but as a victim of a plonker 'other' motorist who... 'didn't see me stopped' in a queue of traffic, and ploughed into me @ 40+mph leaving my back broken and requiring a spinal fusion at 3 levels (and immediately ended my professional career) then 'thank God' for compensation, or I would be currently be living with my family in a wheelie bin!
(No offence to anyone out there who currently live in a wheelie bin, or any other type of bin for that matter!!!) Est-ce que bonjour, vous aime ma nouvelle découverte brillante gentille trois, je pense qu'elle regarde les boules de chiens, pas vous ?
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| 20th Jun 2007 3:39 pm |
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BarryG
Member Since: 30 Apr 2006
Location: Eire
Posts: 1333
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Just spoke with our legal guy (had to talk to him on another matter) and I bounced this
post off him , just to see what his view was.
I explained that disco3.co.uk was not a club (chairman , board , you get the idea) but just a
internet site with a few like minded persons who share a common interest and use the forum to
arrange events and so on.
Asking what would happen if say at one of these off road events, some one was hurt
by another members actions. what would happen next could disco3.co.uk be liable.
and the answer was "it could be" , along with the person who caused the accident
(who's motor insurance might not cover this type of activity as their policy might
not cover "motor sport") and indeed the venue (the land owner) where the event is
taking place.
I dont know to much about the make up of this site only how I have explained it above
the advice from my guy was that the owner (Martin) should seek legal advice in this matter
if he has not done so already.
I hope in some way this might help.
Just to add that this would be the case under irish law that I assume in matters like this would be
the same as Uk law.
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| 20th Jun 2007 4:27 pm |
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wiggs
Member Since: 03 Sep 2006
Location: Manchester
Posts: 14372
 
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This is going to take all the fun out of events  G4 Gone ...but not forgotten
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| 20th Jun 2007 5:17 pm |
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