Member Since: 05 Feb 2006
Location: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posts: 17932
Bill Wright wrote:
Robbie:
I get hesitation (or dwell) for split second when I am in low gear and apply the throttle, for example:
a. When having slowed down to enter a roundabout and accelerate to merge with traffic (always stop now and never try to merge on the move).
b. When leaving a bend at the start of a steep hill the gearbox kicks down,as I depress the throttle pedal, there is a hesitation and then the fuel delivery catches up (I suppose) and off we go.
c. When stationary and pulling out of a junction - I always have to leave a huge gap now to allow for it.
Hi Bill,
I can sympathise as I, like many, had these exact symptoms on pre-MY06 D3s. It really killed the driving pleasure and caused a fair bit of angst at roundabouts. Many on the forum noticed that it went away with an aftermarket remap and Land Rover themselves went on to remap the D3s as part of the 'enhancement programme' in 2006. The revisions made a heck of a difference to my car.
I am not saying that this is the issue here, but hopefully it shows that LR do make efforts to correct such issues down the line. I hope this data gathering helps the process to move as quickly as possible. Having experienced this hesitation on a friend's MY11 I can testify that it really needs sorting.Land Rover - Turning Drivers into Mechanics Since 1948
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
Can i ask a serious question in relation to this ...how are you guys operating the pedal ? Are you a "progressive" or a "foot to the floor" accelerator type ?
I ask as I am a "progressive" and having had 2 D3's and now a D4 ..I fail to recognise this commonly reported issue as a problem Have I just been lucky ?
Member Since: 03 Nov 2007
Location: Glorious Devon
Posts: 3254
I apply a very light touch to the accelerator pedal on each occasion. It's not foot to the floor. The system seems to dwell and think about it for bit and then accelerates quite quickly so that I have to take my foot off the throttle to slow it down. I can vouchsafe that it is a real and disturbing occurrence. The passenger(s) who are not expecting this go through a minor whiplash event as they have no steering wheel to brace against.
Bill Wright Never take life too seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
D4 SDV6 SE Tech Kaikoura Stone MY15.
22nd Feb 2013 1:31 pm
kp
Member Since: 27 May 2011
Location: Sticking the Ex back in the skanks bin
Posts: 2824
I tried both in my D4 XS DG. Both had the same issue and as above 1,2 gears seem far worse for it.
I actually thought at first maybe the TCS is limiting power as it knows it could spin up but it wasnt the case!
Liam i would love to help more with this but i returned the vehicle to a company in cheshire called Kindertons Accident Management. I let them know the fault so they could possibly be chased up with it as i could reproduce it everytime in that vehicle, even better i could do it with a testbook sat in the seat next to me if there was one FFRR Owner, very nearly became a D3 owner
Test piloted a new D4 XS SDV6.. Gone and being forgotten i hope!!
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22nd Feb 2013 1:31 pm
JonM
Member Since: 24 May 2012
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 1247
Not sure I'm going to tell anyone anything they don't already know, but I recognise that this exists on my MY12 HSE. It doesn't usually cause me a problem because I quickly adapted my right foot to apply the accelerator very gently at first and then floor it once the car is under way. This way I seem to be able to get off the mark pretty quickly. If I just come off the brake and floor it, I get the hesitation.
However if SWMBO drives my car I sometimes want a neck brace and crash helmet as she doesn't drive it often enough to get the feel for it.
I've tested standing starts holding it with either the EPB or the foot brake and it will hesitate regardless of which brake was stopping it. So I don't think it's foot brake related.
As I said, the lag doesn't usually cause me a problem except when the gap wasn't as big as I thought and I unexpectedly need full power NOW. What I get is no power for a second or two followed by too much power.
I wonder why LR haven't noticed this when they were measuring the 0-60 time for the vehicle's statistics. I would of thought that trying to do I timed 0-60 would be the perfect way to demonstrate the problem.
PM sent to Liam
Last edited by JonM on 22nd Feb 2013 7:36 pm. Edited 1 time in total
22nd Feb 2013 6:16 pm
Dave T
Member Since: 03 Jul 2009
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 6910
For me it seems to be when rolling slowly to a junction, it just doesn't change down far enough, then when you put your foot down the revs go up but the gearbox takes a few seconds to sort itself out, even if you haven't had your foot on the brake. If you are unlucky enough to start out into a gap in traffic then you find you need to jam your foot down to get going hence severe acceleration. I have found if using paddles or you come to a complete stop for a second or two it is ok.
I have also suffered three occasions of stuttering, nothing conclusive has been found apart from the brake switch wouldn't adjust and has been replaced. Only time will tell if this was he problem.
Whilst mine was in the garage I had a 2012 RRS with the same gearbox and engine, it didn't seem as bad although there was a very slight hesitation at the same junctions and the sudden acceleration was not as bad.Joined the BMWX5 45e group
1994 Defender 90
2015 RRS Corris Grey/Black roof
2016 D4 Graphite Santorini Black
2012 D4 XS Orkney Grey
2005 D3 S Maya Gold
Convoy for Heroes 2011
22nd Feb 2013 7:32 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
sacimiddx wrote:
I guess the threat of law suits etc. worries them - think Toyota and Ford Explorer here
Who is threatening law suits then ? 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
22nd Feb 2013 7:59 pm
sacimiddx
Member Since: 09 Mar 2007
Location: hants
Posts: 2144
DG you can substitute fear for threat
mea culpa I guess
The very concept of semantics is frequently disparaged by wishy-washy passive-aggressives who refuse to be accountable for their careless use of language or their deplorable lack of education.Illegitimi Non Carborundum
22nd Feb 2013 8:17 pm
DeeJay
Member Since: 07 Jan 2011
Location: Devon
Posts: 265
My 6th pence worth. I agree with Dave T. I think the box is a bit lazy in changing down. I have also noticed when using a reasonably light throttle when getting to a hill a slight delay in the down change almost like it's trying to get up, the hill in the highest gear then suddenly decides it can't do it. I think the two are related, In a nutshell the box needs to change down a little earlier in all circumstances.
22nd Feb 2013 8:19 pm
ste
Member Since: 04 Jan 2013
Location: Manchester
Posts: 65
I'm finding when plodding around that I feel the D4 is generally 1 gear to high. Revs are too high, where it should of dropped into a lower gear. I'm manually selecting a lower gear over the automatic. Or lifting off the accelerator to get it to drop down. Is this related to the hesitation? Almost as if the brains of the system isn't quite catching up with what I'm expecting/ wanting to do. If there is an issue can it be corrected with a software update?
22nd Feb 2013 9:24 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
sacimiddx wrote:
mea culpa I guess
Ah ...I thought by your comment there was a case already
Anyway.... I just spent the evening driving through central London and I can't replicate whats described for the life of me
Maybe a poll would give a good indication of the extent of the problem ?21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
22nd Feb 2013 10:20 pm
euangibson
Member Since: 24 Dec 2010
Location: Borders
Posts: 11027
Can I just ask,in full auto mode does the D4 pull away from standstill in 1st or 2nd ?....I only ask because Porsche had a similar issue with the Cayenne....IIRC it would pull away in 2nd,confusing the box when it was asked for extra load"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool,than to speak out and remove all doubt" ?.....what rubbish...
Locking rear E-diff
RLD spare wheel protector & sump guard
Extended roof rails
Series 111 mudflaps
Black side tubes,grill and vents
Timed climate remote
Hids4u interior lights
D4 Firenze my2012 HSE
D3 Java 2005 SE manual (sold,sadly,thanks for the memories)
1966 '88 Series 2a....still starts in the morning better than I do...
23rd Feb 2013 7:32 am
Dave T
Member Since: 03 Jul 2009
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 6910
Not sure, it just doesn't seem to change down when rolling to a junction. Tried the same junctions this morning in auto then using paddles. Using the paddles, there is no hint of a delay, it was instant response.Joined the BMWX5 45e group
1994 Defender 90
2015 RRS Corris Grey/Black roof
2016 D4 Graphite Santorini Black
2012 D4 XS Orkney Grey
2005 D3 S Maya Gold
Convoy for Heroes 2011
23rd Feb 2013 10:24 am
euangibson
Member Since: 24 Dec 2010
Location: Borders
Posts: 11027
I would suggest that is the issue then...in the 8-speed box,the software is not changing into 1st,as that would then lead to potentially too many revs/over-revving coming up to a junction,but if you suddenly require more torque ie by planting your foot,it is taking time to register before changing down to first...leading to the "sudden increased acceleration" being reported.
this would not be an issue with a 6-speed box I believe,as the the willingness to change up/down due to fewer ratios would be less of an issue....?"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool,than to speak out and remove all doubt" ?.....what rubbish...
Locking rear E-diff
RLD spare wheel protector & sump guard
Extended roof rails
Series 111 mudflaps
Black side tubes,grill and vents
Timed climate remote
Hids4u interior lights
D4 Firenze my2012 HSE
D3 Java 2005 SE manual (sold,sadly,thanks for the memories)
1966 '88 Series 2a....still starts in the morning better than I do...
23rd Feb 2013 10:36 am
euangibson
Member Since: 24 Dec 2010
Location: Borders
Posts: 11027
If somebody could get an answer from LR as to whether the 8-speed is programmed to pull away from rest in 2nd then I think we may be onto something here ?"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool,than to speak out and remove all doubt" ?.....what rubbish...
Locking rear E-diff
RLD spare wheel protector & sump guard
Extended roof rails
Series 111 mudflaps
Black side tubes,grill and vents
Timed climate remote
Hids4u interior lights
D4 Firenze my2012 HSE
D3 Java 2005 SE manual (sold,sadly,thanks for the memories)
1966 '88 Series 2a....still starts in the morning better than I do...
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Have I just been lucky ?
but it wasnt the case!
