Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
Thanks alan wasnt sure how to get them pics up.
18th Aug 2014 5:47 pm
Allan_T
Member Since: 10 Sep 2012
Location: Northampton
Posts: 1034
It should look like this, but from your pictures it appears the upper timing belt idler has been forced upwards through the timing cover, if the idler bolt failed the tension from the belt would be forcing the idler upwards.
Click image to enlarge
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18th Aug 2014 6:30 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
Hope its not the end of my disco. Just checked it was nov 2012 that all the belts were changed inc oil pump housing and 2x egr valves. Always looked after it only just had deisel fuel filter changed 2 days ago and was booked in this week for a oil change on the gearbox inc new filter and sump. Gutted
18th Aug 2014 6:43 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
Apparently when they recovered it oil was present under the car and garage said there was only 3 litres left in the engine. Any thoughts.
18th Aug 2014 6:47 pm
Disco_Mikey
Member Since: 29 May 2007
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 20837
That looks like the casting that the idler pulley bolts onto has snapped off the block
Must take some force to do that. I wonder if it is a bottom end issue that has caused it...My D3 Build Thread
Member Since: 26 Mar 2007
Location: Chandler's Ford
Posts: 3464
As Allan has already suggested, the focus of the investigation should be on the upper timing belt idler pulley bolt. It does look very much as though the idler has been forced up through the top of the timing belt cover.
Where did you have the timing belt(s) done? Did they replace the upper timing belt idler pulley at the same time? If so, did they use a new bolt? Was it torqued to specification?
Lots of questions still to be answered here before you can pinpoint the exact cause.
Based on the assumption you had the work done at a Land Rover dealer (may be a wrong assumption), you've now made enough posts to be able to send a PM to "Pete@LandRover" to see what Land Rover are going to do about it.
Good luck.
Steve2021 BMW iX3 Premier Edition in Carbon Black ⚡️🔌
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18th Aug 2014 6:53 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
Sorry should have clarified. Work was done at my local garage who deal with all the mod landrover defenders so they re assured me they knew what they were doing but now im not too sure. Its with them now but they dont want to start stripping it down until i give it the go ahead. Not sure i want them to touch it incase it makes matters worse with lr.
18th Aug 2014 7:01 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
How do i contact pete@landrover on this site.
18th Aug 2014 7:08 pm
Woolmeister
Member Since: 26 Mar 2007
Location: Chandler's Ford
Posts: 3464
The problem you have is that you did not have the work done at a LR dealer. The guys you used will point the finger at Land Rover for the crap casting/bolt whilst Land Rover will no doubt claim the burden of proof - that the bolt was torqued correctly - will be on the indy you used.
You can reach Pete by sending a PM to "Pete@LandRover" but I imagine you're going to have to get it to a LR dealer for them to inspect before you make any progress on diagnosing exactly what broke. Getting your indy to diagnose the problem may only make matters worse and LR may be less willing to get involved if the engine has already been dismantled.
I understand Pete has done what he can to help a number of forum members. Unfortunately, if your indy has cocked-up (and I'm not sure how this could be proven), then I would not be too hopeful of getting anything out of Land Rover.
You are better off talking to others on here who have had similar failures. I may be wrong, but I believe this failure is the first of its kind on here. Normally, the timing belt tensioner shears off the oil pump casting; not the upper idler pulley. Worrying times.
Steve2021 BMW iX3 Premier Edition in Carbon Black ⚡️🔌
2019 Škoda Kodiaq 2.0 Tdi 190 DSG Sportline in Quartz Grey. Excellent vehicle. Gone.
2017 Discovery Sport HSE Auto in Carpathian Grey and Ebony Leather. Modern JLR Junk. Gone.
2007 Discovery 3 TDV6 S Manual in Zermatt Silver with Ebony Cloth (143k) Gone, but now patrolling the Asia section of the West Midlands Safari Park!
18th Aug 2014 7:29 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
Thanks steve for the good advice. Kind of gutted that i didnt get lr to do it but i did my homework on here before hand and spoke to lr directly explaining why i was changeing the oil pump housing and they didnt want to know. I even raised the question that if something was to happen regarding cam belt failure after they instaled a new one where would i stand they didnt want to know and could not put my mind at ease. Its just a shame that they do not acknowledge this problem as it seems to be getting more and more comon.
18th Aug 2014 7:45 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
It looks like as (woolmeister) steve said the bolt has snapped releasing the tensioner. Lr rang the wife today. They have even said they suspect the bolt was either overtightened or undertightened so wrong torque setting exactly as steve said in a post above. There going to get back to me tomorrow regarding costs.
26th Aug 2014 5:07 pm
Allan_T
Member Since: 10 Sep 2012
Location: Northampton
Posts: 1034
Good news that the predicted cause of failure has been confirmed
Will the Indy cover any of the costs?GAP IID Pro Multi Vehicle Defender L316 2007-2015 - Discovery 3 - Discovery 4 - Discovery Sport L550 - Freelander 2 - Range Rover Evoque L538 - Range Rover L322 - Range Rover L405 - Range Rover Sport L320 - Range Rover Sport L494 Electrical Fault Diagnostics
26th Aug 2014 6:24 pm
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
At this moment in time no. But we havent realy gone down any avenues yet only spoke to someone on the service department and he told us he suspected it was the local garages fault for torque settings being wrong. Not happy with them as yet but early days.
26th Aug 2014 6:29 pm
eljot
Member Since: 15 Nov 2013
Location: wasserburg am inn
Posts: 90
hey guys,
will get my belts changed (incl. oilpump, etc.) the next weeks at my LR dealer.
i can remember that i read here somewhere something about different bolts for the tensioner, etc. but can not find it anymore.
have two different bolts on the lr-quote:
LR000374 and LR006027!
are these the correct ones?
thx for helping, martinSWMBO asked to get us a RELIABLE family car - I bought a Disco 3!
15th Sep 2014 7:40 am
h4rr1s51
Member Since: 27 Nov 2011
Location: liverpool
Posts: 17
Just thought i would give you all a quick update. Car is still at hatfields 8 weeks on and no help from jlr cr. Hatfields have been wonderfull and have kept me informed whilst jlr cr havent bothered. I have had to esculate the problem to katie a manager who is now sending the part of the bolt that is not in the engine to there forensic team for analasys. Acording to hatfields service manager the independent garage provided them with the print off guide from there topix web site wich they had followed plus they also have something called data cad along with calibrated certified torque wrenches. Landrover still insist this was torqued incorectly and that the results of the bolt will be concluded by next wednesday. Im thinking they may have to send me the parts back after analysis so i can start my own investigation. Im not hoping for much at this stage but currently writing a letter to the directors and seeking advice elswhere.
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