Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50971
JMC wrote:
Anyone who feels the need to complain and strike about pay, T&C's etc should be forced to go self-employed and contract themselves to their ex-employer now 'customer'.
Self-employed or employed ......a 'contract' would still apply 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
Anyone ever tried taking a customer to court for not going through with a purchase order or a verbal order
Besides, there aren't 100,000 lazy sods comrades willing to strike on your behalf then...... The older I get, the more I realise that people confuse wrinkles for wisdom
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4th Oct 2007 4:46 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50971
So what are you trying to say JMC Is your perception of every person who is employed a lazy sod? Is that what you think of your employees? 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
Is your perception of every person who is employed a lazy sod?
Don't be silly DG. My experience of employees comes from the smaller end of the SME's which form the backbone of the UK economy. There are a number of lazy sods out there (typically unionised) who would rather skip grafting for their / their employers benefit, and would prefer to take the money for as little effort as possible.
These employees typically know their 'rights' but bear few of the responsibilities that are supposed to go with them Furthermore, they have no comprehension of why the unions were a necessary institution or the struggles that brought them into being. They see their membership simply as a means to beat their bosses with a stick for their own selfish ends. Typically, it's the small employers who bear an disproportionate level of the responsibilities - both for themselves and their employees.
It would certainly be fair to say that my views are tainted. I always looked after my staff and rewarded their efforts - some said too much I found that the more you give, the more they want, and they soon forgot how comparatively well off they were versus people working the same type of jobs in other small firms.
The final straw for me was an industrial tribunal. Without going into details, my wife and I had two years of publicly funded hassle because an employee decided they could take time off without warning for about three weeks on the trot. This was the only employee that I ever 'sacked' and it isn't something I took pleasure in. However, this person decided that a tribunal would work in their favour and was a free shot at getting something more for nothing. I was one of only six employers that year who won their case. It didn't stop me feeling 'hard done by' and my appetite for employees was lost.
I'm known for cutting off my nose to spite my face..... Disgusted with the imbalance in rights / responsibilities, I shut down the business (£4M turnover), paid out all the redundancies which left me broke and vowed to be totally self-reliant in future.
To answer your questions - No, I don't think they are all lazy sods, but I do think they should generally be more responsible about their employment rights safety net. As far as my current employees are concerned....... what makes you think I have any? The older I get, the more I realise that people confuse wrinkles for wisdom
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4th Oct 2007 7:32 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
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Posts: 50971
The employee employer relationship can be an endless tug of war sadly. 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
4th Oct 2007 8:26 pm
SN
Member Since: 03 Jan 2006
Location: Romiley
Posts: 13710
rogue wrote:
i had to sit on the personnel committee for my local school and ensure that some "mediocre" teachers got money for basically turning up.... end'eth the sermon.
Been there, done that, pi55ed me off. But what pi55ed me off more was the head teacher's fixation on making sure that "differentials were not eroded" - in other words she and her deputy would get pay rises JUST to ensure they were paid more than the highest paid teacher FFS! Steve N | 21MY Defender | 08MY Discovery 3 (history) | 06MY Discovery 3 (ancient history)
4th Oct 2007 8:34 pm
AndrewS Tarquin of the Desert
Member Since: 06 May 2005
Location: Y...... because I can
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Well the postal strike has forced me into getting my accounts software sorted for emailing invoices, confirmation of orders etc etc. So when they come back to work, they wont need to work as had because they wont have to deliver my invoices anymore.In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded.
4th Oct 2007 8:38 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50971
You sound surprised Steve ...in reality we all want more for ourselves.... that is human nature As far as money and comfortable conditions are concerned nobody wants less do they ? At what level are people asking for less ?? The self-employed want more, Employees want more, management want more, the shareholders want more, the lenders want more.
MORE.. MORE... MORE... MORE ...It's beginning to sound like a Swedish porn flick 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
Don't assume to speak for all on that. I don't especially want more, I simply want to maintain what I have worked for. If you offered me £1M to take a job tomorrow I'd tell you (politely) to go away. It's a throw away phrase but there is more to life than money and I reckon few of us actually need more. It was a revelation to discover some time ago that when you don't have anything left to dream about life is a lot less interesting. I'm not suggesting that I'm vastly wealthy (I don't have a butler ), but I don't want or need a butler. I dream about an Aston Martin Volante and could probably have one tomorrow, but the dream is a lot nicer than the reality probably would be. Just don't take my Disco away The older I get, the more I realise that people confuse wrinkles for wisdom
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4th Oct 2007 9:32 pm
simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
JMC wrote:
... form the backbone of the UK...
Thats what our fracking government needs
4th Oct 2007 11:17 pm
simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
JMC wrote:
I don't especially want more..
I do
JMC wrote:
Just don't take my Disco away
Oh yes... that is my concern at the moment.
4th Oct 2007 11:20 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50971
simon wrote:
JMC wrote:
... form the backbone of the UK...
Thats what our fracking government needs
... sad fact of the reality is that it's all much of a muchness no matter who is in power...jubilation of another party in place is relatively shortlived...especially when the 'government' realise that their plans are full of holes and they are not actually 'in power'..... the grinding cogs of the Civil Service and interpreters of the Law are 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
Last edited by DG on 4th Oct 2007 11:39 pm. Edited 1 time in total
4th Oct 2007 11:31 pm
simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
DG wrote:
.. sad fact of reality is that it's all much of a muchness no matter who is in power...
Less than a hundred to go now DG..... The older I get, the more I realise that people confuse wrinkles for wisdom
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4th Oct 2007 11:41 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
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I've not been counting 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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