Take your point....lets pick computing as the subject which my knowledge base is limited on . I have an annoying problem where i get a google message come up every time i reboot my computer, the only way ive found around it is to 3 finger salute it and then stop it with the task manager. I have churned through countless google links to find an answer yet iam unable to. Now this is a computing issue which is outsides most peoples understanding...something is clearly happening in the back ground which im not aware of, i dont profess to know the problem yet i have done my research and ive drawn a blank. So what do i do? Have i written a post asking what material my Toshiba laptop is made of although it is clearly made of plastic....no i havent.
Some questions are technical and i would never expect people to know alot of the answer...but come on ffs some people take the micky. Whats this light for...what this made out of....should i stick my hands in the fan when the engines running...if i hit myself with a hammer will it hurt.....COMMON SENSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
27th Jun 2011 11:29 am
euangibson
Member Since: 24 Dec 2010
Location: Borders
Posts: 11027
packingstrips...I do get all your points...and the frustration you and others must feel....but I will always defend someones right to ask questions....I guess the problem comes when the more experienced and hands-on contributors have to fend off the less-so....and the perceived "dumbing down" that the asking of such questions contributes to....
I have been a member of Pistonheads for over 11 years now,and joined when I owned a TVR......I haven't contributed for a long time because 1.I don't own the car any more, and 2.it has been infiltrated by the Citroen Saxo brigade....
I know you brought up the subject of "common sense".....Common sense dictates that we should always look before crossing the road,but the stats show us every year that many people do not
Maybe I should have changed my original post of "a question is only difficult if you DON'T know the answer" to "A question is only easy if you KNOW the answer".....
Just please go easy on the less informed,and continue to pass on to others the valuable and much-appreciated knowledge which I,for one,have found invaluable "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool,than to speak out and remove all doubt" ?.....what rubbish...
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27th Jun 2011 11:52 am
Dave T
Member Since: 03 Jul 2009
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 6910
I think this has drifted a long way from JFs original point, in that he feels (along with many others) that there is sometimes too much censorship, which is driving a lot of very knowledgable people away from here. A point that is being made more and more frequently recently.
I for one have gained so much from their knowledge, and in the process saved an absolute fortune, it would be tragic if the knowledge disappeared from this forum!
The search function has also been debated in this thread, don't know about anyone else, but it isn't always the easiest thing to find a specific topic until you get used to terminology used and the right phrases.Joined the BMWX5 45e group
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27th Jun 2011 12:05 pm
devonchilliman
Member Since: 03 Nov 2008
Location: Devon
Posts: 5224
Dave T...
I have to agree with everything you have said above
Is such a real loss to the forum to lose so much helpful & invaluable knowledge Www.devonchilliman.co.uk
27th Jun 2011 12:19 pm
Moo D3 Decade
Member Since: 13 Aug 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 14409
Ditto.
27th Jun 2011 12:39 pm
Riccardo
Member Since: 20 Feb 2010
Location: Porto (was Kent)
Posts: 4123
Dave T wrote:
I think this has drifted a long way from JFs original point, in that he feels (along with many others) that there is sometimes too much censorship, which is driving a lot of very knowledgable people away from here. A point that is being made more and more frequently recently.
I for one have gained so much from their knowledge, and in the process saved an absolute fortune, it would be tragic if the knowledge disappeared from this forum!
The search function has also been debated in this thread, don't know about anyone else, but it isn't always the easiest thing to find a specific topic until you get used to terminology used and the right phrases.
It is really a shame to loose valuable people and I hope JF Lux will reconsider his decision
euangibson wrote:
I know you brought up the subject of "common sense".....Common sense dictates that we should always look before crossing the road,but the stats show us every year that many people do not
Maybe I should have changed my original post of "a question is only difficult if you DON'T know the answer" to "A question is only easy if you KNOW the answer".....
Just please go easy on the less informed,and continue to pass on to others the valuable and much-appreciated knowledge which I,for one,have found invaluable
I really do not see the point. If somebody consider something stupid why not just ignore it and concentrate on the more valuable/techincal discussions. Somebody else will provide an answer if needed.
We all get what we might consider stupid questions in the things in which we are experts, the point is that this is a nice place because it is not only a place for experts and it is an invaluable resource for anybody.
The thread will die if it is stupid!
Often people (seems to be little group of friends) starts to go off topics with personal discussion within members in the context of something else. That is also rather annoying as you see there is a new post of something interesting and then it is an exchange or personal things between members which has nothing to do with the topic (maybe they can use more PM). Isn't that also very stupid and probably even more annoying than a potentially stupid request?
I think a lot of things can be considered stupid but we just need to ignore those
Last edited by Riccardo on 27th Jun 2011 12:56 pm. Edited 1 time in total
27th Jun 2011 12:53 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
Guys I think you need to understand that there is a long standing issue with one company which JF Lux was fully aware of but yet again chose to undermine the wishes of the site owner by making direct and indirect references.
If people want to post info involving a well known situation which will draw a known response from moderators then could it be seen as provoking a 'Death Edit by Mod' scenario designed to put the site in a bad light ??... Throwing the toys out of the pram over a known situation is a bit perplexing.... I certainly wouldn't want them to leave over it ....but if they feel that strongly then that is up to them I guess.
Aside from the usual spammers, For Sale & Wanted issues and some poor jokes there isn't much other moderating TBH and the site has been quite for some considerable time.
There has been recent comment about newbies not searching ...but I take the view that if I can help then fine if I can't then fine .....there isn't really anything to get hot under the collar about. Gareth has recently made a post offering some search tips and Martin is looking at improving the the search features.21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
27th Jun 2011 12:56 pm
Martin Site Admin and Owner
Member Since: 06 Nov 2004
Location: Hook Norton
Posts: 18563
The core of this particular topic being started is down to the disagreement between myself and GNVP, which had lead to the situation where I do not want them to be mentioned on this forum.
JF Lux, you've raised this issue many, many times in the last year or so and you know full well the reasons I have for this decision. You seem to want to drag this up and test the matter every few months for reasons that presumably are only clear to you and a handful of others.
GNVP are the only company who are explicitly forbidden from this site, for their utter contempt of the site, its management and the rest of the members.
It is not a site policy to censor discussions at all, or do this as a matter of course (despite what certain people think and shout about). However, when a company and its owners decide to break just about every one of the site rules on multiple occasions and I take issue with that, how come I am the one who is being accused of being in the wrong?
There was not at the time, and has not been since, any sort of apology by GNVP or its owners for what they did.
I'm expected by a few people to forgive all that GNVP's owners did on this site, and that just isn't going to be possible.06 D3 SE / 15 LR D90 XS SW / 88 LR 90 Td5 / 68 BMW 2000 ti
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27th Jun 2011 1:03 pm
Bodsy Site Sponsor
Member Since: 06 Nov 2006
Location: In the Clubhouse
Posts: 21361
It was 18 months ago........
People come onto this forum asking for help and advice on all sorts of things, offering google searches or ebay is part of the norm......Bodsys Brake Bible
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27th Jun 2011 1:37 pm
DiscoDunc
Member Since: 08 May 2006
Location: Bristol
Posts: 16390
Martin, its not just the censorship of GNVP - there are numerous other occasions when other matters have been censored, threads deleted, sometimes without even the courtesy to tell the authors or say why..Duncan
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27th Jun 2011 2:56 pm
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26774
To be fair Dunc, we decided a while ago to ease up on the censorship of commercial links when the poster clearly had no association with the business, and the context was purely relevant to a discussion on the forum. We also undertook to notify the OP if we had to edit.
Other than our blanket ban on promoting GNVP, Can you give me any recent examples?
27th Jun 2011 3:12 pm
J@mes
Member Since: 10 Nov 2008
Location: Bomber County
Posts: 4547
How recent are we talking? Last year I passed my trailer towing test with a member of this forum. I put a web link to their driving training site and it was deleted, I assume because we have a sponsor who teaches people how to tow. Despite the fact they are about 80 miles apart.
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27th Jun 2011 3:15 pm
Martin Site Admin and Owner
Member Since: 06 Nov 2004
Location: Hook Norton
Posts: 18563
Other than already discussed moderation on here fits into these categories:
Spam
For Sale posts outside forum rules
Off topic chat in on topic conversations
Removal of jokes which overstep the mark
Members taking spiteful pops at each other
There's never going to be 100% agreement on how a site is moderated, but I think that, by and large, the moderating on here works well and isn't at all heavy handed.
Clearly in an ideal world no moderation would be necessary, but with a site of this size and with such a varied membership it's only natural that it is sometimes required. It's never the intention to purposely wind anyone up by moderating, but obviously the nature of what's being done means that one or more people aren't going to be happy.
27th Jun 2011 3:15 pm
DiscoDunc
Member Since: 08 May 2006
Location: Bristol
Posts: 16390
Quote:
Other than our blanket ban on promoting GNVP, Can you give me any recent examples?
not that I can reference off the top of my head - ive kind of lost interest a bit to be honest... but if the censorship has eased off, then i still percieve it to be there Duncan
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If I'd known I was going to be so thirsty this morning I'd have drunk more beer last night.
FFRR Autobiography 4.4 SDV8 MY17
D4 HSE MY13 SOLD
FFRR 3.6 Vogue TDV8 SOLD
D4 HSE MY10 SOLD
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D4 XS MY12 SOLD
D4 HSE MY10 SOLD
D3 HSE MY06 - Re-Cycled Worldwide
Last edited by DiscoDunc on 27th Jun 2011 3:31 pm. Edited 1 time in total
27th Jun 2011 3:19 pm
Martin Site Admin and Owner
Member Since: 06 Nov 2004
Location: Hook Norton
Posts: 18563
Moderation has gone through a lot of changes in the last 9 months or so which have made it much freer, fairer and more open than it was before.
Without searching through all your posts James .... .... I couldn't exactly whether your case was before the change in policy, but it's certainly not something that we would do now or would have done for a good while.06 D3 SE / 15 LR D90 XS SW / 88 LR 90 Td5 / 68 BMW 2000 ti
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plastic....no i havent.
from JFs original point, in that he feels (along with many others) that there is sometimes too much censorship, which is driving a lot of very knowledgable people away from here. A point that is being made more and more frequently recently.
.... I couldn't exactly whether your case was before the change in policy, but it's certainly not something that we would do now or would have done for a good while.
