Member Since: 17 Nov 2005
Location: Glawstershire
Posts: 539
Middle Lane Owners Club
What is it with this f!!!ing country?
Yesterday I drove from Prague to the Cotswolds, the first 700 miles were fantastic, cruise control at 85 (apart from Belgium where it is illegal ) Spent most of the time in the middle lane overtaking lorries and cars with trailers, inside lane when not filled with aforementioned lorries and used the outside lane when neccesary to overtake the vehicles in the middle lane.
Even on the parts of the Autobahn that are just 2 lanes the traffic flowed freely and sensibly, even the Mother-in -Law (anagram of Woman Hitler) who was sat in the back for the entire journey didnt whine. Had to move out of the way sharpish a couple of times as I was not going fast enough for the BMW's but they can be excused!
Got back into Blighty at 19.00 hit the M20, what a wake up call, the outside lane was chockablock, the middle lane was full of cars and the inside lane was sparsely occupied with lorries, it drove me mad, why cant it be enforced, some tw4t in his car, knuckles white, eyes wide open with sheer terror sat in the middle lane and wonders why he keeps getting overtaken by people who then go past him, and pull into the inside lane.
It makes it so damned dangerous, coupled with the fact that the M40 was closed so I had to take the M4 along with the world and his mother and didnt get home for an extra 4 hours
The Mother-in-Law on arriving inthe UK did comment to the wife that she was scared for the first time in the entire journey, but I think she struggles with driving on the right side of the road as she is Czech.
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30th Oct 2008 9:50 am
crews control
Member Since: 18 Mar 2007
Location: Dorset
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Middle lane s , (you need 4 lane changes to get past them at night!)
Reminds me of a rant I had last year when driving back from the Frankfurt motor show... 5 hours from Frankfurt to Ashford in Kent and then 9 hours from Ashford to Fleet in Hampshire !!! Reasons too numerous and boring to list here, but mainly revolve around standard of driving/roads/Wombles in the UK.
It's total madness to pay for all these motorways to be widened when we're not even using the inside lane properly, (which is usually empty). It's an easy solution, allow passing on either side. What we need is a system which allows everyone to pick a lane which is moving at the speed they wish to travel, and then stay there. This drastically reduces lane changes, which are usually the dangerous bit, and trains people to be aware of both sides of their vehicle.
I realise this is contentious, and I'm likely to be shot down in flames, but I was in Canada the weekend they swapped from our system to either side overtaking and it worked really well. They had a national 50 mph limit for a week while people got used to it and then started using the roads properly. It would be great to have another 30% capacity on our motorways.
scarred politicians with no imagination, balls or idea!
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30th Oct 2008 1:53 pm
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26779
I'm with you on this CC. The only thing is, in countries that have pass on either side rules, the speed limits are probably lower. It could work if the speed limits were enforced in this country.
There is too great a difference in this country between the slowest and fastest traffic for it to be safe.
30th Oct 2008 2:07 pm
Reggieb
Member Since: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Watford, Herts.
Posts: 707
IMHO the existing standards on our road have slipped to an appalling standard in the past 15 years or so and have been really bad for the last five.
Lane disciple is never enforced and as previously mentioned the inside lane is sparsely populated, I am guilty of overtaking and then cutting across their bows to the nearside lane but they seem oblivious to my presence & carry on with a fixed stare.
Nobody seems to get warned for driving without due care these days but if you exceed the limit or put a wheel in the box junction the yellow vultures are flashing away instantly.
God I really sound like a
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Last edited by Reggieb on 30th Oct 2008 2:29 pm. Edited 1 time in total
30th Oct 2008 2:24 pm
crews control
Member Since: 18 Mar 2007
Location: Dorset
Posts: 5011
How's it safer to have an old codger in a bourneville coloured 1970's Rover doing 45 in the middle lane when all the sales reps are squeezed into one lane to get past in their mundaneo's doing 90? Besides, I'm not sure people who can't cope with traffic on both sides of their vehicle should be allowed on the motorway's at all?
Maybe a minimum speed limit then? 2005 D3 HSE 2011 D4 Landmark 2016 D4 HSE Lux
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30th Oct 2008 2:27 pm
crews control
Member Since: 18 Mar 2007
Location: Dorset
Posts: 5011
Quote:
but if you exceed the limit or put a wheel in the box junction
Yeh, but they can earn an income (tax) you for this.
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30th Oct 2008 2:30 pm
Reggieb
Member Since: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Watford, Herts.
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Quote:
Yeh, but they can earn an income (tax) you for this.
It's not about road safety, it's about revenue earning
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There is a minimun speed limit on motorways, it is 40mph, but it is very hard to impose, ie heavily laden vehicles on a steep incline, traffic jams etc.
What I do believe is that there should be another test to be taken before a driver is allowed on a motorway.
I did hear somewhere that the Police are going to have a clamp down on it though.I'm not as good as I once was........but I'm as good once as I ever was.
Member Since: 18 Mar 2007
Location: Dorset
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Interesting read Hobgoblin, It would be great to see the authorities take action, trouble is, I doubt the ability of the middle lane hoggers to actually notice any signs, they're not even aware of other road users! We've also put so much money into speed camera's and cheap rate plastic policemen (Highways agency/Wombles) that there's barely enough properly trained traffic police to enforce the laws we already have.
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Couldn't agree with you more... But the biggest culprits in my view are the truck drivers. Most of my travelling is on dual carriage ways and motorways and 90% of the near misses I see are down to truckdrivers pulling out into the second lane with little or no indication and not being able to match the speed of the traffic travelling in that lane causing everyone behind to take avoiding action, namely braking hard. There was talk about banning them from over taking on dual carriageways last year. Can't come soon enough for me!
Apologies to any of our truck driving members if there are any but the standard of truck driving has got worse this last 10 - 15 years or so. Foreign drivers perhaps??
30th Oct 2008 3:34 pm
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26779
I think most truck drivers would probably blame the 56mph speed limiter for that. I do a lot of motorway driving, and find the vast majority of truck drivers are very good.
The problem is when the CLOD (Centre Lane Owner Driver) does not notice that the truck on lane 1 that he is approaching at a closing speed of 0.00001 mph has been indicating to pull out for the last 10 miles. Instead of noticing the indicating truck, and then indicating himself/herself to pull into lane 3 to allow the truck to pull out, the CLOD brakes hard and causes the ripple effect that our motorways suffer from.
There is a minimun speed limit on motorways, it is 40mph, but it is very hard to impose
Sorry to bear bad news but this is totally incorrect.
There is NO MINIMUM SPEED on UK motorways. Eire has a 30mph minimum but not here The older I get, the more I realise that people confuse wrinkles for wisdom
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30th Oct 2008 3:42 pm
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
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I posted this a couple of years ago.
Here is the scenario. Its Friday evening on the M6 north from Birmingham to Manchester. Its perfectly normal in as much as its running at 65 - 70 mph in lane 3, nose to tail.
lane 1 is wall to wall juggernauts, and lane 2 is almost wall to wall with juggernauts trying to overtake the juggernauts in lane 1, because they are travelling 0.0000000000001 mph faster (down hills). There are however gaps in between the juggernausts on lane 2, of about 1/4 mile.
You are in lane 3 travelling behind Mr Avensis at the same speed, at a safe distance. You really would like him to pull over, as you wish to travel a little bit faster, and get home earlier.
However, there is a problem with this; Mr Avensis in front also wishes to get home earlier, and wants to go a little bit faster and would actually like Mr Mondeo in front of him to pull over and let him past. BUT, Mr Mondeo is late for dinner, and really does want to get home quick before the dog gets it, so he is actually quite insistant that Mr Vectra in front pulls over to let him overtake. The thing is, Mr Vectra is on a promise, if he can get home in time to book a table in the restaurant, his luck will be in tonight, so he's pulling over for nobody.
Mr Avensis is getting bored by Stafford, and thinks that a quick flash with the halogens will get Mr Mondeo to kindly pull accross to lane 2, and Mr Avensis will then be merrily on his way home at a faster speed. Unfortunately, Mr Mondeo is really getting quite hungry, and is now very worried that Rover the dog will get to eat his sausage and mash, so declines the invitation to pull over, and carries on.
The thing is, Mr Mondeo is quite an impatient man, and has had enough. He takes it upon himself to give Mr Vectra a full dose flash with his brilliantly bright xenon main beams, accompanied by a few hand gestures just to encourage him. Mr Vectra takes exception to this, and with all the testosterone flowing through his veins at the thought of the evenings activities, if he can get home in time, sees fit to encourage Mr Mondeo to test his braking ability, or ultimately his air bag, on the rear of his car.
So, Mr Mondeo, not to be out done, decides that the only course of action is to pull into lane 2 and try to sneak up the inside of Mr Vectra without him noticing. Futile. Mr Vectra is soon on his case and gradually increases his speed so that Mr Mondeo is faced with impact on the rear of the juggernaut rapidly coming towards him, or he could floor it, and hope that Mr Vectra will back off, and let him in (fat chance!), or he slams the brakes on.
Fortunately he chooses option 3. However, he is now desparate to rejoin the line, so decides that Mr Avensis WILL let him in, and proceeds to robustly cut in front of Mr Avensis, forcing him to brake hard. You are Mr Discovery following Mr Avensis. You are sensible and left a gap, so collision is avoided, and everone proceeds happily on their way.
Good? NO. Mr Avensis is now severely with Mr Mondeo, who has an issue with Mr Vectra. Mr Vectra has the H N and is still desparate to get home, so is pulling over for no body. You are getting annoyed by all of this, when guess what? Would you believe it, Mr BMW comes up behind you, and has the audacity to flash his lights at you and demand that you pull over and let him by.
Now you have a real dilemna on your hands. Do you let him by, and add one more lunatic to the fight in front? they might all crash and block the road in front of you, therefore really delaying you. You could just pull over and let him past couldn't you? Thats the sensible option most of us would take (honest?).
What you did not realise, is that behind Mr BMW, lurking in the shadows was Mr Sprinter, who is a big white bloke who takes no prisoners. He's been after Mr BMW since Watford, when he cut him up. He not going to let you back into lane 3 is he? so you are forced to slow down before you reach the next juggernaut. You then realise that Mr Sprinter has a great following, all they way back to Birmingham, none of which want to let you become a member of his fan club. So you are forced to drive at 56.0000001 mph, as the juggernaut you are stuck behind overtakes the juggernaut in lane 1 that is doing 56.00000001 mph. You never know, look on the bright side, he may pass him by Carlisle.
Gareth,
I think we will have to agree to disagree on that one. Yep you're right that CLOD does cause problems but I have seen cars in the outside lane pushed into the central barrier by an overtaking truck driver on 2 occasions and one driver kill a guy and badly injure his daughter on the hard shoulder in bright sunny conditions with only 3 people on the motorway. There are still lots of good Truck drivers but there much more bad ones than there used to be!
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) Spent most of the time in the middle lane overtaking lorries and cars with trailers, inside lane when not filled with aforementioned lorries and used the outside lane when neccesary to overtake the vehicles in the middle lane.
