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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26775
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I think that all Land Rovers should be absolutely fine with a part set of new tyres. Maybe with the exception of Freelander and some Classic Range Rovers that use a viscous device.
On some vehicles, the slight difference in roational speed caused by mismatched tyres is deemed enough to ruin a fluid coupling over a long period of time. Why that is I have no idea.
If you have the time, read this, it explains a lot 
http://www.4x4abc.com/4WD101/diagonal.html
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 3rd Jun 2008 9:43 pm |
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BLFarrar
Member Since: 02 Aug 2006
Location: Deepest, Dankest, Darkest, Dingiest......Le Halifax, West Yorkshire...with strong links to Ireland
Posts: 6222
  
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Read the script from Countrywide...I merely extended the point
countrywide wrote:This doesn't make sense, if your turning left for instance, the passenger side wheel will turn less than the drivers side and this will be the same on the rear, so how does this affect the centre diff. If your doing tight turns, the rear wheels turn less than the front wheels which have a wider arc to take.
It makes no sense that a few mm difference is that critical or you would suffer transmission wind up all the time. Also if the road is uneven the distance travelled will change to far more of an extent than the tyre wear.
I heard the XC90 had major problems with tyres being scrubbed out due to a 4WD system that didn't accommodate the differing wheel rotations & was also a problem on early series 1 Freelander's. BREXIT - done properly.
Right now ...We need Government - not Politics
Save the Dipstick Flagbearer-keep it simple, less likely to fail campaign-agenda items:Starting Handles, Acetylene Lamps.
Founder: Dipsticks-R-Us Inc
D3 HSE-perfectly formed, passenger friendly...has real DIPSTICK
Jag XK-but sadly no DIPSTICK...HUGE design fault
FL2 has DIPSTICK..."real comfort in rear seats"
VW Golf wondermobile (?)..has real DIPSTICK
Morris Minor..original DIPSTICK technology..and a real KEY.
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| 3rd Jun 2008 9:45 pm |
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simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
 
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Davro wrote:Looking at swapping my front/back over to gain a little more miles and also make sure I need 4 new ones together !, should I get the tracking done or just make sure they are balalnced ?. Is this someting the dealer should offer to do when in for a service ?
Swapping front to back is actually one of the service items to do at certain services ISTR.
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| 3rd Jun 2008 11:33 pm |
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simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
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Neil Pettersen wrote:simon wrote:.. it was a Quattro and apparently according to Audi, could cause premature wear to the drive train ....
Now, that's got to be a question for JMC 
Not an Audi Coupé Quattro.... and A4 Avant Quattro 
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| 3rd Jun 2008 11:34 pm |
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BLFarrar
Member Since: 02 Aug 2006
Location: Deepest, Dankest, Darkest, Dingiest......Le Halifax, West Yorkshire...with strong links to Ireland
Posts: 6222
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Some data needed
Gareth wrote:Maybe with the exception of Freelander and some Classic Range Rovers that use a viscous device.
I was under the impression that all series RangeRover used std diff & in some cases LS Diffs - not viscous.......conversely the series one Freelander has std diffs front & back with a ..cheap & cheerful viscous coupling in the middle.
Gareth wrote: some vehicles, the slight difference in roational speed caused by mismatched tyres is deemed enough to ruin a fluid coupling over a long period of time. Why that is I have no idea.
Viscous couplings (non mechanical device that uses silicone fluid.....like a torque limiting engine fan drive) hasn't the ability to sustain major axle mismatches it doesn't let the axles assume their natural rotational speed - resulting in scrubbed tyres (Freelander Series One & Volvo XC90)
Gareth wrote:if you have the time, read this, it explains a lot
....but not very well...... i have seen & read this before...but read again.....a differentials primary function is to allow a vehicle to turn without scrubbing tyres or losing traction...the writer is explaining the whole issue without having this principle as the concept of the explanation..preferring to talk about torque transmission straight line.
.....its easier to visualize a 2WD drive axle diff first....understand its principle then expand it to 4WD & then accept the concept of front / back wheels & axles all going proportionally different rotational rates - especially around corners....the old Subaru website had the best explanation & diagrams....
Still cant see how a D3 can detect tyres rolling dia & have active diffs without the two conflicting with each other .....it don't add up ...unless its speed related.
http://www.4x4abc.com/4WD101/diagonal.html[/quote] BREXIT - done properly.
Right now ...We need Government - not Politics
Save the Dipstick Flagbearer-keep it simple, less likely to fail campaign-agenda items:Starting Handles, Acetylene Lamps.
Founder: Dipsticks-R-Us Inc
D3 HSE-perfectly formed, passenger friendly...has real DIPSTICK
Jag XK-but sadly no DIPSTICK...HUGE design fault
FL2 has DIPSTICK..."real comfort in rear seats"
VW Golf wondermobile (?)..has real DIPSTICK
Morris Minor..original DIPSTICK technology..and a real KEY.
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| 4th Jun 2008 6:00 am |
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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26775
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Gareth wrote:Why that is I have no idea.
Like I said, I'm no authority on the subject, I go by the book, and the book on the D3 does not mention changing all 4 tyres.
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| 4th Jun 2008 8:18 am |
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Valleyforge
Member Since: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Westmorland actually
Posts: 188
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FWIW I changed al 4 'cos they all wore down equally. The previous d2 wore the fronts more than the rear by quite a substantial margin. No problems though - but always used the same tyre makes & sizes.
PS saw a new model D3 this am, coloured trim, exhaust exits thru the rear bumper etc (as per 1962 Vauxhall Victor.....) actually looked ok, despite earlier reservations. I liked my D2, but my D3's better ....(& the RRS better still)
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| 4th Jun 2008 9:24 am |
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DingMark
Member Since: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Perth Oz or Erbil, Iraq
Posts: 388
 
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Not realising what I'd done, during Xmas we drove about 4500 km with 3 x 9" wide wheels and 1 x 8" (OEM) wheel. The tyres were what is called here a "dog's breakfast" of Scorpions and Goodyear ATs in various stages of wear. The D3 didn't miss a beat - this was pulling a box trailer and pretty high sustained speeds (120 km when no one looking) and it handled the same as when all 4 were the same size and new.
We didn't notice the tyre mix until changing over to 4 x 8" x 19" wheels with MTRs and installing the shortened height sensors. Anyone else done a "mixing test"? Maybe the sundried roads here are so coarse and rough that it masks a handling issue. Jim Dowell - D4 HSE TDi, 12,000 hydraulic winch & hidden winch mount, MTRs, TyreDog, Traxide 2 x aux battery system, fixed air compressor, Dolium roof rack, MitchHitch.
RIP 2005 D3 HSE V8 5 seater gold (stolen and torched)
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| 4th Jun 2008 12:02 pm |
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Bushwanderer
Member Since: 27 Nov 2007
Location: Northern Rivers, NSW, Australia
Posts: 2050
 
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Hi DG,
Are you serious? 
There is NO way that I would use the same rubbers in all situations. 
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| 5th Jun 2008 7:41 am |
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Bushwanderer
Member Since: 27 Nov 2007
Location: Northern Rivers, NSW, Australia
Posts: 2050
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In all seriousness, IIRC with my D1, the instructions were to carefully match the tyres. If this wasn't possible, it was important to swap the tyres front-to-back in order the balance the wear on the drivetrain. I think that the transfer case was the issue. If running with smaller tyres either front or back, the transfer case has to make up the difference in rotational speed. This, in time, imposes extra wear factors on the TC.
I wouldn't be surprised if this also applied to the D3.
Best Wishes,
Peter
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| 5th Jun 2008 7:52 am |
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DaveT
Member Since: 01 Aug 2005
Location: Cornwall
Posts: 2576
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Back in 2005, when I killed my first pair of rear tyres, I took the precaution of checking with my trusted local LR dealer whether tyres had to be replaced in sets of 4 or if it was OK to only replace 2.
The answer from LR was that it was definitely not necessary to replace all 4. The vehicle could accommodate differences in dia. due to wear.
As an aside, I've just swapped back from my 255/60-18 Scorpions to my 255/60-18 AT2's, and it would appear that the AT2's are in reality slightly smaller in diameter than the Scorpions (about 20mm!) Long succession of Disco's since 2001...
SIII Lightweight - neglected & rusting. Bulkhead, A panels, vent panel & outriggers now disintegrated - Next years project!
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| 5th Jun 2008 10:25 pm |
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paul
Member Since: 12 Feb 2006
Location: Midlands
Posts: 594
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We did over 60k in an Audi A4 2.5tdi Quattro sport Auto and never changed all 4 tyres together and were never told to by Audi at any of the services as twice they changed 2 pairs for us. Father in law has an A4 2.5tdi Quattro Avant with 180k on in 4 years all by him and he has never changed all 4 together and again has never been told to by Audi and he has had 9 sets on the front and 7 sets on the rear without any drivetrain issues.
At work we use some A6 3.0TDI Quattro's and they don't change all 4 tyres on those together and that's the Police so I guess thy should be working to Audi specs.
Regards Paul 2006 TDV6 S Auto, Buckingham Blue, for the wife and kids.
2013 BMW 535d M sport touring.
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| 7th Jun 2008 8:02 pm |
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caverD3
Member Since: 02 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
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I suspect it is a ruse by the tyre retailer to get you to buy more tyres when you don't need to.
I had to buy five new Cooper HTs from Bob Jane (because the lease company would not deal with my usual tyre guy), two days later a small nail puntured the tread just on the side. They refused to repair, quoting OH&S and wanted to sell me a new tyre. 
Went to usal tyre guy repaired no problems, I even asked if I should put it on as a spare. They said that the repair would last longer then the tyre. “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
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| 8th Jun 2008 3:45 am |
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Renny
Member Since: 30 May 2006
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 292
 
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I had the same problem at Costco with the D2, until I pointed out they only had two tyres in stock
They replaced the two front tyres which were worst worn, fitting the new ones to the rear as they insisted. I was mildly amused that a month or so later when the stock was back in, they insisted on fitting the new tyres to the rear, despite my mention that they had only done about 5-600 miles.
Now I wonder how they justify the Manual Handling risks of that I asked myself as a H&S Adviser?  Renny Thomson
aka Scottish Scrutineer or MM0KOZ
MSA Scrutineer
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| 10th Jun 2008 5:13 pm |
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Gurvan
Member Since: 02 Jan 2005
Location: Germany... Not far from both the US and Hard German rock...
Posts: 1089
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I am bringing this one up again as some as***le has probably ruined one of my rear tyre using a knife or some same sort of device.
The consensus seems to be that, as long as the tyre are fairly matched (I mean the same brand and the same size) there should be no problems in changing ONLY one tyre ?
Or do you advise on changing BOTH tyre on the same axle ?
The other tyre on that axle has 20K Km on it... The spare full size tyre is new...
Thanks for simple answers !  After all, I am NO technician especially when the other party is speaking in English...  Georgia On My Mind...
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| 14th Jun 2008 2:01 pm |
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