Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50979
Red Merle wrote:
Under normal road conditions yes But, off road, it’s much harder to judge the position of the corners against immovable objects! And the cameras are too clumsy and inaccurate to judge a distance in an instant.
Yes the 'corners' are of course more rounded but like anything, familiarity will overcome any initial maneuver judgement you need to make in a new vehicle. Once you have the visual in your mind that you have the same 4 or 5 inch bumper protrusion beyond the edge of the bonnet it becomes second nature just like it would in any vehicle.
For those hoping for a future resumption of non curvyness...even to an extent in the new Defender, it just isn't going to happen...why? ...because increasing demands on pedestrian safety and emissions reductions dictate that the slab front end is a thing of the past.21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
16th Apr 2018 10:23 am
LT
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: South West
Posts: 23866
Having driven a D3/4 for the past 12 years, it’s what I’m used to now and I do notice the difference when I drive our other three cars or anyone else’s. It feels safer and more convenient to me.
Given a choice I’d much rather have such a commanding view, but ultimately I could of course live without it. As I did for 20 odd years before I got a D3. It’s a shame though, as IMO, it’s another LR USP that’s gone by the way.2006 D3 HSE (Original & still the best)-GONE
2010 D4 HSE (A bit bling)-GONE
2014 D4 HSE (Almost too bling)-GONE
2015 D4 HSE (A heated what?)-GONE
2016 D4 Landmark (Written Off)-GONE
2016 D4 Landmark (Surely the last!) PD1881 rims-GONE
2017 FFRR SDV8 Autobiography (now semi-retired)
16th Apr 2018 10:28 am
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50979
You are about a foot taller than me to begin with so I understand that of course you will have concerns ...but as someone who has, as you know, had D3's & D4's for a similar period and made the transition to the D5 then I have to say from my POV it is one of the very least noticeable aspects of change and that's why I'm harping on about it. In fact if nobody had mentioned it then it wouldn't have entered my mind.
What does enter my mind and what I'm presented with every day is the substantial improvements overall and particularly in the cabin.21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
16th Apr 2018 10:45 am
LT
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: South West
Posts: 23866
I’m really pleased that you find the D5 suits you better than the D4. That’s probably the case for the majority, hence why LR made so many changes. Sadly though I’m in the minority.
Hopefully LR will cater for the likes of me with the new Defender. Hopefully!!2006 D3 HSE (Original & still the best)-GONE
2010 D4 HSE (A bit bling)-GONE
2014 D4 HSE (Almost too bling)-GONE
2015 D4 HSE (A heated what?)-GONE
2016 D4 Landmark (Written Off)-GONE
2016 D4 Landmark (Surely the last!) PD1881 rims-GONE
2017 FFRR SDV8 Autobiography (now semi-retired)
16th Apr 2018 10:54 am
Red Merle
Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 7441
DG wrote:
For those hoping for a future resumption of non curvyness...even to an extent in the new Defender, it just isn't going to happen...why? ...because increasing demands on pedestrian safety and emissions reductions dictate that the slab front end is a thing of the past.
I wouldn’t give up all hope just yet...
Even taking into account the fact that the current FF is already around 5 years old, GM managed to move on from blobby styling and put a low, square edged and flat bonnet on the newly introduced Insignia and still meet current and expected regs
Click image to enlarge
Click image to enlarge
2011 - 2015: 3 x FL2
2015 - 2017: 2 x D4
2017 to date: FFRR SDV8
2023 to date: 2 x FL2 as “second” cars 🙄
2021 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200
2022 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200 & sidecar!
(One of only two known to exist in the world!)
Last edited by Red Merle on 16th Apr 2018 12:10 pm. Edited 2 times in total
16th Apr 2018 11:18 am
Canburne
Member Since: 15 Jan 2013
Location: Devon
Posts: 2037
DG wrote:
Sorry LT... in the middle of splitting the thread there
Yes the front is not square for sure but you get used to that very quickly...as for the rear view ...the ability to fold the rear headrests flat (when not in use ) makes for a much clearer 'full rear window' view from the drivers position IMO
Can all the passengers in rows 2 and 3 please lower into the crouch position because I can't see out of the back .
"the inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings....the inherent vice of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries" Winston Churchill
2016 D4 Landmark Club Waitomo ...or is it Club Tempest????
2015 D4 HSE Aintree Green
16th Apr 2018 11:54 am
Red Merle
Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 7441
To be fair, they are already sitting much closer to the floor than they were, so it should be easy to see over them! 2011 - 2015: 3 x FL2
2015 - 2017: 2 x D4
2017 to date: FFRR SDV8
2023 to date: 2 x FL2 as “second” cars 🙄
2021 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200
2022 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200 & sidecar!
(One of only two known to exist in the world!)
16th Apr 2018 12:06 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50979
Canburne wrote:
Can all the passengers in rows 2 and 3 please lower into the crouch position because I can't see out of the back
Wow ...is it really that funny ...you need to get out more
Merle ..the moment you start posting pictures of a Vauxhall Insignia trying to compare them to SUV\ 4x4 then I think my job here is done 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
16th Apr 2018 12:21 pm
J77
Member Since: 03 Mar 2008
Location: Fife
Posts: 6272
I like that colour.23.5MY Defender 90 X-Dynamic SE D250 MHEV Pangea Green
16th Apr 2018 12:24 pm
Red Merle
Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 7441
DG wrote:
Merle ..the moment you start posting pictures of a Vauxhall Insignia trying to compare them to SUV\ 4x4 then I think my job here is done
I’m happy to be the one quoting examples to illustrate my argument, if you stick to the broad, largely unfounded, generalisations then 2011 - 2015: 3 x FL2
2015 - 2017: 2 x D4
2017 to date: FFRR SDV8
2023 to date: 2 x FL2 as “second” cars 🙄
2021 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200
2022 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200 & sidecar!
(One of only two known to exist in the world!)
16th Apr 2018 5:39 pm
KTM Gordo
Member Since: 18 Jul 2017
Location: St Neots
Posts: 109
Red Merle wrote:
If it were solely down to the “height of a driver’s eye”, every car, or van, with a high driver’s seat could be said to have a “command driving position”, so the term becomes completely meaningless; we might just as well all buy Ford Transits
The last Transit I drove had a low, car-like seat and driving position.
One of the problems for manufacturers is the way motoring journalist write about them in the comics. I remember reading a review of Evoque where it lost points for not feeling car-like and for having dual-purpose tyres which made for too much road-noise.
With that way of thinking, instead of praising anything that's different and differentiates one vehicle from another, it's used as a negative point to say it's the wrong shade of beige.
But in terms of Land Rover, the Disco Sport has the stadium seating arrangement (just), as does the D5.
As for whether JLR has lost touch with its roots, it doesn't exist to preserve nostalgia, it's there to sell new vehicles. The Land Rover community has a whiff of flat-earth society about it sometimes with anything that's not built on a 1970s ladder chassis being heretical.
Either way, the upright driving position is still clinging on. Just.Gordon
2016 D4 Landmark, Yulong White, SDV6, Ex-JLR Fleet
2013 D4 HSE (Gone! Sold within the forum)
16th Apr 2018 6:03 pm
RRSTDV8
Member Since: 07 Apr 2014
Location: Here
Posts: 13609
Wow, the same old argument rehashed for another round of D5-hatred.
Visiting from rrsport.co.uk
2012 RRS SDV6
2008 RRS TDV8
"When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die! You don't know who's children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they were always going to have to do from the very beginning: SIT DOWN AND TALK!"
16th Apr 2018 7:38 pm
Red Merle
Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 7441
I thought it was an interesting bit of debate/banter and I do believe that it might just have come about as a result of a certain D5 owner coming along to helpfully tell us how dated D3/4’s are 2011 - 2015: 3 x FL2
2015 - 2017: 2 x D4
2017 to date: FFRR SDV8
2023 to date: 2 x FL2 as “second” cars 🙄
2021 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200
2022 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200 & sidecar!
(One of only two known to exist in the world!)
16th Apr 2018 8:03 pm
Russell
Member Since: 23 Aug 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 10564
I have always said the D3/4 and now 5 are all great cars in their own time. However you look at it things have to move on and some will not always like the move.
At th end of the day the5 is not the same as the 4 but for diffrent reasons it is progress and we will not see a 4 box againMY17 D5 1st Edition Namib Orange
MY15 D4 HSE Kaikoura Stone
MY12 D4 HSE Nara Bronze Sold and gone
MY11 D4 HSE Stornaway Grey Sold and gone
D3 S spec Silver Sold and gone
Tow bar, full length roof bars, side steps, tow bar storage unit, surround camers.
D4 camera club
16th Apr 2018 8:15 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50979
Red Merle wrote:
I do believe that it might just have come about as a result of a certain D5 owner coming along to helpfully tell us how dated D3/4’s are
Hark at the guy who jettisoned his for a full fat ...are you saying that is equally as dated as a D4 and that gets you a get out of jail card?
I loved my D3s & 4s with a passion ...but they are yesterdays motors now and although they were an iconic design, by comparison they are clearly dated ...onwards and upwards 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
But, off road, it’s much harder to judge the position of the corners against immovable objects! And the cameras are too clumsy and inaccurate to judge a distance in an instant.
so I understand that of course you will have concerns ...but as someone who has, as you know, had D3's & D4's for a similar period and made the transition to the D5 then I have to say from my POV it is one of the very least noticeable aspects of change and that's why I'm harping on about it. In fact if nobody had mentioned it then it wouldn't have entered my mind.
...you need to get out more 
