DISCO3.CO.UK - View topic - Keeping the suspension "UP".

GraemeS

Member Since: 17 Mar 2008
Location: NSW
Posts: 706

2010 Discovery 4 3.0 TDV6 SE Auto Nara Bronze

Hi Sean,

I'm glad the switch arrived in time. I had no involvement in sending the missing switch, only hearing about it afterwards and providing a replacement for BD. I still can't fathom my omitting it but know all too well that I am not immune from making mistakes. There may be more to the story as I haven't had my demo kit returned from BD yet and the last time I saw the RRS in which the demo was installed, it had both my demo switch in its temporary box and a properly-mounted switch. However I was only concerned that someone hadn't received a switch and as it happened, you almost missed having a useable kit that was presumably purchased for its capabilities for this very trip.

Your type of use is exactly why I set out to try to provide a useable way of overcoming the automatic lowering, expecting to have to resort to shorter rods permanently fitted whilst on an outback trip. I'm pleased that you found it particularly useful on its first outing. I sometimes drive at 100kph+ at +50mm on my 4km gravel lane just to re-assure myself that driving at this speed and height presents no handling nasties, although I've not tried it loaded for a trip.

I had an alternate route home planned through that area when I last passed through Birdsville after my Madigan's Line trip in my D2 but now look forward to a specific trip to see Central Qld.

Thanks for your comments.

Graeme Home of LLAMS, for LRs and Jeep GCs

4th Nov 2010 2:21 am

GraemeS

Member Since: 17 Mar 2008
Location: NSW
Posts: 706

I should point out that the Llams unit can be calibrated to give more than off-road height due to it learning heights rather than having pre-set heights. People who have installed a kit may have already recognised this flexibility. The +50 setting is the full height difference between normal and off-road height, +30 is 60% and -20 is -40%, not specific height values.

As the +50 height increment is learnt from the sensor signals when the vehicle is at off-road and at normal heights, by not strictly following the calibration instructions and using either a higher off-road height (eg forcing extended height using a block of wood) or a lower normal height (eg using access height - the easy method), a greater height increment will be calculated. When faced with a deep water crossing, an impromptu calibration might be worthwhile to obtain about super-extended height when used with off-road mode, perhaps even retaining the impromptu calibration for the trip and using +30 where +50 would normally be used. A suspension fault might occur if full suspension drop occurs when this +50 and off-road mode are used together.

Edit: This might not be a feasible use as although the calibration makes +30 the same as off-road height and +50 approximately the usual +50 used with off-road mode, after numerous attempts I could not get the front fully raised in off-road mode, always waiting for the compressor to cool. Therefore the only advantage is that +50 in normal mode doesn't have the off-road mode speed limit although I can't imagine the circumstances where travelling at over 50 kph at this height would be desireable. Home of LLAMS, for LRs and Jeep GCs

Last edited by GraemeS on 5th Nov 2010 7:36 pm. Edited 1 time in total

4th Nov 2010 3:46 am

seanc

Member Since: 17 Oct 2010
Location: Townsville
Posts: 4

2010 Discovery 4 3.0 TDV6 HSE Auto Stornoway Grey

Greame,
I have been running with the height controller set at -20mm when on highways. I thought there may be a fuel improvement with less wind resistance in a slightly lower vehicle. Haven't enough K's on the clock yet to prove or disprove as we only had just over 1,000km on clock when we left Townsville last week. Have you any data on whether it makes any differnce to econemy?
sean
ps
heading to Victorian high country next after a couple of rellie visits around the Murray region. Really looking forward to that and am more confident in the D4 now after the last week.

5th Nov 2010 12:26 pm

GraemeS

Member Since: 17 Mar 2008
Location: NSW
Posts: 706

My concern with extended -20mm use is possible wheel alignment changes although it can't be too bad because its the 160kph+ height. I rarely use that height and only for improved handling or for less perceived speed when I'm going a bit fast on corners. My D4 doesn't sit as flat as others due to having fitted D3 sway bars. I have no information on fuel usage savings. Home of LLAMS, for LRs and Jeep GCs

5th Nov 2010 7:24 pm

caverD3

Member Since: 02 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922

2012 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 SE Auto Fuji White

I think making a brick 20mm closer to the ground is not going to make a lot of difference to the fuel consumption

â€œThere are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.

5th Nov 2010 11:21 pm

roveribis

Member Since: 04 Apr 2009
Location: Puerto Rico
Posts: 132

Now I'm confused....

I thought that while being in off-road height, I could move the LR3 to extended mode with the switch. When Offroading with my 33" tires, I use extended mode most of the time (with the rods). Am I confused? Or are you guys trying to get extended mode without being in off-road mode in the car? (i.e. no warning bell).

I'm about to install the kit this weekend, and want to make sure I can run in extended mode while in low-gear-off-road.

Thanks -------------------
2008 LR3
ARB bumper, winch, sealed Snorkle, dual battery, Rover Specialties sliders, whole car custom skid plates, 33" tires, ARB air compressor, CB radio, etc...

5th Nov 2010 11:35 pm

~Rich~

Member Since: 16 Mar 2009
Location: Sydney
Posts: 628

2014 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 HSE Auto Fuji White

caverD3 wrote:
I think making a brick 20mm closer to the ground is not going to make a lot of difference to the fuel consumption

I agree Andrew, I don't use this setting on freeways because of the fact that tyres wear quicker the faster you go.
Where I do use it is on twisty roads for better handling!

It really makes a difference.

roveribis wrote:
Now I'm confused....

I thought that while being in off-road height, I could move the LR3 to extended mode with the switch. When Offroading with my 33" tires, I use extended mode most of the time (with the rods). Am I confused? Or are you guys trying to get extended mode without being in off-road mode in the car? (i.e. no warning bell).

I'm about to install the kit this weekend, and want to make sure I can run in extended mode while in low-gear-off-road.

Thanks

I have used the +50 when in off road mode ( = +100mm over standard ride height) and would not recommend using Super Extended mode (SEm, you cannot select this mode using L/R switches!) unless it was critical to getting out of trouble. If using the before mentioned setting and you get grounded the vehicle will itself select SEm.
Otherwise you would be running at + 125mm over standard height and downward travel would be very small and fault codes may occur with the slightest additional travel.

Rich. 2014 SDV6 HSE White, LLAMS Height Controller, Tinted Glass, Tuff Ant Sliders and 18" steel wheels, Safari Snorkel, Rhino Rack Platform, ARB Air Compressor, Custom Drawer and storage unit -http://www.box.com/s/jem0ilac3cner2mexq64 UHF CB, 4x4 Intellegence RWC, 120ltr Long range tank, Rock Sliders and Compressor protection plate Beanie grill, De Tango.

6th Nov 2010 12:14 am

GraemeS

Member Since: 17 Mar 2008
Location: NSW
Posts: 706

roveribis wrote:
Now I'm confused....

Are you still confused? I think my little excursion into a non-standard calibration was not helpful, except in confusing people. Sorry. Home of LLAMS, for LRs and Jeep GCs

6th Nov 2010 9:58 am

Preacher

Member Since: 15 Aug 2009
Location: NE Victoria
Posts: 141

2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Auto Bonatti Grey

ordered mine on thursday am and received it friday

good delivery

now we see how easy it is to fit

dj

13th Nov 2010 10:40 am

Desert Traveller

Member Since: 06 Aug 2006
Location: The Gabba - QLD
Posts: 420

2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Auto Chawton White

All this talk about trips out west are making me really miss Australia and my D3. I fitted the Llams over a month ago and have been in Nth America and the UK ever since.

DT 06 TDV6 SE with many LR and after-market extras. Used only on weekends and trips out west.
Audi TT Roadster (Daily and around town drive)
VW Eos TDI For Sale
Previously 01 TD5 and 94 TDI

13th Nov 2010 1:49 pm

Bushwanderer

Member Since: 27 Nov 2007
Location: Northern Rivers, NSW, Australia
Posts: 2050

2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 S Manual Buckingham Blue

Wow,
That's suspension travel that Graeme didn't mention.

The Bearded Dragon

13th Nov 2010 10:13 pm

Preacher

Member Since: 15 Aug 2009
Location: NE Victoria
Posts: 141

GraemeS wrote:
roveribis wrote:
Now I'm confused....

Are you still confused? I think my little excursion into a non-standard calibration was not helpful, except in confusing people. Sorry.

Graeme,

just purchased my kit and delivered next day interstate and country - well done!
question
what were you talking about above??
reason
(havn't installed your system yet) when I trick my suspension into extended mode from off road it only goes up about 10mm - thought it should go up about 50mm?? how do I get it working as it should - does the dealer do his thing to get it correct and if so should it be done before I install your kit or afterwards.
question
back to what you were trying to explain - should this give us a little more height or ????

dj

16th Nov 2010 2:55 am

GraemeS

Member Since: 17 Mar 2008
Location: NSW
Posts: 706

Hi Preacher,

BD wasn't tardy in getting your kit despatched!

I understood that extended height was about another 50mm above off-road height but can't find my source. I also thought super-extended as something like another 20mm. Hence my suggestion that +50mm combined with off-road mode equates to about extended mode height, mostly finding mine to be about 90mm from standard. I don't know why your vehicle only goes up 10mm unless its still rising when you have checked the height.

My understanding is that height sensor calibration is only to establish normal height, there being no procedure to calibrate off-road height, but off-road height to be a programmed sensor voltage increment. I don't know what a dealer might do other than check that all height sensors are working properly but if there's a problem, it would be best to get it sorted whilst the system is unmodified. However you could fit the kit and see if +50 with off-road mode gets up to around 90mm above normal height.

My excursion into an alternate Llams calibration procedure was to show how a greater (almost double) "+50mm" height can be established. However when trying the higher +50 with off-road mode, my vehicle's compressor failed to finish raising the front within the time I was prepared to wait, wanting to cool multiple times. Thus I considered that the idea was not practical and counter-productive to reducing the work of the compressor. Home of LLAMS, for LRs and Jeep GCs

16th Nov 2010 10:04 am

caverD3

Member Since: 02 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922

There is a difference between LR quoted figures and reality. The off road height is supposed to be 50mm above normal but 40 mm is more usual. Extended is about 15mm in reality and super extended about another 15-20mm. Mine does an extra over 30mm above in all settings so in off road it is about 70mm above normal off road. â€œThere are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.

16th Nov 2010 12:07 pm

Preacher

Member Since: 15 Aug 2009
Location: NE Victoria
Posts: 141

There is a difference between LR quoted figures and reality. The off road height is supposed to be 50mm above normal but 40 mm is more usual. Extended is about 15mm in reality and super extended about another 15-20mm. Mine does an extra over 30mm above in all settings so in off road it is about 70mm above normal off road.

I've looked thru a couple of forums to see if anyone's posted details of suspension heights etc - can't seem to find any authority on it, even in FAQ. (THE book says it's supposed to be 55mm) So decided to do my own calculations, which are as follows:

Height taken from random datum point - D3 empty

Height...............At Rear...Diff from On/Rd...Total rear...At Front...Diff fromOn/R...Total front
on road............. 160mm...... (10mm)...........................150mm....................................
off road............. 210mm....... 50mm........... 50mm........ 200mm...... 50mm.............50mm
extended............230mm........20mm............70mm........ 210mm...... 10mm ........... 60mm
super extended....250mm....... 20mm........... 90mm........ 230mm.......20mm............ 80mm

This could be a good guage to check other heights just to see what is happening out there - if the dealer can adjust them back to what they are suppose to be it makes a good starting point for maximum clearance regardless of whether we have the Llams system fitted or not.

Also had a mild remap performed with a kw increase of 18% and a Nm increase of 21% - not too shabby - certainly not neck snapping, but noticable when I first had it done.

17th Nov 2010 11:24 am