Member Since: 19 Dec 2011
Location: rainford
Posts: 1581
Missfire and rough running advice plea
Hi im still having a nightmare with the d3
I had 6 new injectors fitted and it ran ok for 5 miles then missfire back
Ive checked all the usual culprits namely
New fuel filter
Maf
Map sensor
Checked injector wiring / no leaks
New battery
Alternator fine
New clutch and dmf
Egrs are blanked and butterfly valve removed
The ecu has been checked and stated as fine by an ecu specialistk
The injector values are all over the show even with a new set of injectors.
Anyone got ANY ideas on what could cause this missfire and send a wrong signal to the injectors
Could it be a sensor?
Would a failing fuel pump /pumps give erratic injector values that shift from injector to injector?
Car drives 90% once moving but shakes and sometimes stalls at idle, also after stalling its a swine to restar with accelerator making no difference to revs until it comes alive again
Really appreciate some input as have exhausted forum and google searches and no EML to date
Only listed faults relaye to injectors from iid tool but this was the same with old injectors and brand new replacements?
Been in touch with Flack who can hopefully come across in few weeks but really want some ideas to look at as car has been unusable for 3 weeks now and is killing the bank account!
It might be worth checking the crank position sensor. Firstly just check the torx bolt is not loose/missing.
Its fiddly to get at as it hidden by the turbo.D1 300TDI ES. just kept going, sold at 170k miles, body beginning to rust
D2 TD5 GS. sold at 140k, chassis beginning to rust
D3 TDV6 SE. 194k Still going.
3rd Dec 2017 10:24 pm
Leesbay
Member Since: 19 Dec 2011
Location: rainford
Posts: 1581
Thanks Thamesd3
Would this cause the injector values to fluctuate all over the place and cause the missfire?
Where abouts around the turbo so i can locate and check? Is there a test that i can do to if its failing?
Havent had any Lights on dash or codes off iid to suggest this may be a cause to date though
Rgds
Lee....................................................................................................
If my wife ever sells my stuff for what she thinks I paid for them, you lot are gonna get some bargains!
Here is a picture of the sensor on a tdv6 Jag which is the same.(flywheel removed)
If its faulty you would get an error code but if its just loose you could get erratic running.D1 300TDI ES. just kept going, sold at 170k miles, body beginning to rust
D2 TD5 GS. sold at 140k, chassis beginning to rust
D3 TDV6 SE. 194k Still going.
Last edited by ThamesD3 on 3rd Dec 2017 11:09 pm. Edited 1 time in total
3rd Dec 2017 11:01 pm
Leesbay
Member Since: 19 Dec 2011
Location: rainford
Posts: 1581
Thanks will check in yhe morning
All inputs from d3 members appreciated ....................................................................................................
If my wife ever sells my stuff for what she thinks I paid for them, you lot are gonna get some bargains!
3rd Dec 2017 11:03 pm
defector
Member Since: 23 Feb 2009
Location: Greater Manchester
Posts: 1471
I don't think this is a crank sensor issue but a fuel issue.
Crank sensor does not have anything to do with fuel pressure.
I don't know what the fuel rail pressure should be, but if the live data fuel pressure is near enough to what the standard value is, then high pressure pump should be ok. (Just checked and yours looks ok as it should be just over 3000 psi at idle - but you need to know live v theoretical at about 2000rpm just to discount HP pump).
The injector values are all over the place which, to me, indicate injector issues.
Were the injectors new/recon and what was the reason for changing?
I would do a injector leak off test to see if it is injectors again.
Did you check fuel and filter when doing replacement as the fuel may be contaminated or even wrong fuel - smell to see if any petrol present.
If you need a leak-off kit let me know as i have one.
4th Dec 2017 1:42 am
lynalldiscovery
Member Since: 22 Dec 2009
Location: Maidstone
Posts: 7274
I have read oil temperature sensor (screws into side of the sump) can cause idle misfires, once I read that I changed mine as preventative maintenance.
+1 For changing the Oil temp sensor its a known issue to causing rough running.
Flack
4th Dec 2017 8:48 am
Disco_Mikey
Member Since: 29 May 2007
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 20841
defector wrote:
I don't think this is a crank sensor issue but a fuel issue.
Crank sensor does not have anything to do with fuel pressure.
I don't know what the fuel rail pressure should be, but if the live data fuel pressure is near enough to what the standard value is, then high pressure pump should be ok. (Just checked and yours looks ok as it should be just over 3000 psi at idle - but you need to know live v theoretical at about 2000rpm just to discount HP pump).
The injector values are all over the place which, to me, indicate injector issues.
Were the injectors new/recon and what was the reason for changing?
I would do a injector leak off test to see if it is injectors again.
Did you check fuel and filter when doing replacement as the fuel may be contaminated or even wrong fuel - smell to see if any petrol present.
If you need a leak-off kit let me know as i have one.
I'm thinking along these lines too. Weak LPFP/HPFP, especially if it struggles to start after cutting out My D3 Build Thread
Member Since: 19 Dec 2011
Location: rainford
Posts: 1581
Thanks for the recent replies chaps👍
Car back with the garage who put new injectors in
When i got it back a few days ago it drove spot on for a few miles then starting missing and got progressivey worse after 30 miles to a point that it stalled and was difficult to restart.
As it appears brand new injectors didnt cure it im wanting these out and old ones back in to get a refund on these
Garage will continue to investigate and i will discuss the lpfp and hpfp as mentioned above
With regards oil temp sensor, i got a temperature value reading off the iid which corresponded to coolant temp approximately, would this suggest that sensor is functioning ok and to ignore this as a possible fault?
Hoping that the garage will get to the route failure and the tech is being very good with me but if not then hopefully a reimbursement of injectors and get the d3 back so that Flack can assess.👍 just have to give the garage an opportunity to continue given theyve had £2k+ and havent cured it but a big chunk of this is likely to be regunded from the new injectors being removed....................................................................................................
If my wife ever sells my stuff for what she thinks I paid for them, you lot are gonna get some bargains!
6th Dec 2017 11:45 pm
lynalldiscovery
Member Since: 22 Dec 2009
Location: Maidstone
Posts: 7274
As the sensor is so cheap and easy to change I would just fit it anyway.
Be interesting to see how you get on with the refund on the injectors as they wont be able to return them.
7th Dec 2017 12:35 am
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26775
Well if they won't refund, I'm sure you'll get a decent amount for them on here.
Going back to basics a bit ... New sensors fitted and it was ok for a short while then fault returned. I know you've listed new filter as being fitted but is it possible it's crud that was in the pipes being pushed into the new injectors?.
Dean
====================================
2011 D4 XS - OBD port protection, RLD spare wheel protector, All LED interiors lights, Timed Climate enabled, iiD tool paired.
2011 D4 Landmark - Stolen from same dealer before I paid for it
2011 D4 GS - Stolen whilst at dealer ... All LED interiors lights, DRLs, Spare Wheel protector.
1996 300Tdi - Eaten by tin worms
7th Dec 2017 8:52 am
Leesbay
Member Since: 19 Dec 2011
Location: rainford
Posts: 1581
Dean i was told that the fuel has been checked and was ok
I am also suggesting that the tank is dropped to check in tank pump filter and condition to permanently rule out
The car ran perfect for maybe 20 miles after new injectors fitted but missfire came back with a vengeance soon after. Seems worse the warmer it gets and struggles to maintain idle. After stalling the accelerator is non responsive and comes back to life after a few minutes running like a bag if spanners on its own
No fault codes other than injector codes showing on the iid.....................................................................................................
If my wife ever sells my stuff for what she thinks I paid for them, you lot are gonna get some bargains!
7th Dec 2017 11:53 am
Weedyapl
Member Since: 23 Sep 2015
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 81
I dont think it will end up being LPFP apparently our car will start and run fine (not under load) with fuse pulled e.g. no LPFP. Those injector values are really bad for a new set of injectors. I wonder if you have a faulty ECU (controls our injectors) or lack of compression. All the bad HPFP ive seen on here at least seem to be either injectors wont fire due to lack of pressure (wont start) or car runs ok but stalls out at high rpm with DTCs. If your kms are low compression issues would be unlikely I’m thinking it could be your ECU not sure if you can swap em easily with ours maybe try source one to borrow or test from one the techs on here? Good luck!
Last edited by Weedyapl on 10th Dec 2017 10:36 pm. Edited 2 times in total
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... All LED interiors lights, DRLs, Spare Wheel protector.
