Member Since: 29 May 2007
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 20822
Wear and Tear, or bearing failure?
Having a battle with a warranty company on a forum member's car. Noisy diff, warranty wanted the diff out the car, and opened up to check the bearings. This is what was found:
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Noisy bearing (already removed from the diff):
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Both of those bearings were from either side of the diff. As you can see, one looks OK, the other is
Car has done 60-70k miles IIRC, not enough to have reached LR's service interval for an oil change
So, fair wear and tear, or premature failure?
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9th Aug 2013 7:06 am
MarkOne
Member Since: 23 Jul 2011
Location: County Antrim
Posts: 3345
Don't know about poorly manufactured, it could be that it has been worked hard ie pulling a heavy trailer. It looks to me it's wear and tear regardless.
9th Aug 2013 7:14 am
countrywide
Member Since: 16 Sep 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 6019
Ask them for a definition of wear and tear as they should have one, it wil be difficult to apply at that mileage.
The car is designed to pull heavy trailers, so even if it is wear and tear, it can be abnormal rather than normal wear and tear.
9th Aug 2013 7:19 am
euangibson
Member Since: 24 Dec 2010
Location: Borders
Posts: 11027
When my diff was on the way out (at 70k) on the d3,I was aware of the dreaded "wear and tear" exclusion on my warranty ........ran it a bit longer till it went properly and my Indy then got it through under "sudden and catastrophic failure".....the problem you now have is that they know about it,so "sudden" ain't going to work
It's such a grey area...when is "premature failure".....and what exactly is "wear and tear" in their small print....
Ps my warranty company sent out their own inspection engineer and he authorised the claim on the spot
Good luck though "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool,than to speak out and remove all doubt" ?.....what rubbish...
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Series 111 mudflaps
Black side tubes,grill and vents
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9th Aug 2013 7:47 am
H16UUP
Member Since: 01 Dec 2012
Location: Stockport
Posts: 271
That's premature failure, because:
a) Low mileage (these days 100k on all major components is reasonable to expect, on average)
b) Failure before manufacturer's recommended first oil change interval
Glad I've just changed my diff oils at 54k.
9th Aug 2013 8:05 am
john watson
Member Since: 10 Nov 2011
Location: lanark
Posts: 966
D_M need a bit more info
[1] are the bearings both sides from the same manufacturer? If so who? I would have expected something like "Timken"
[2] Any nasties in the oil?
[3] Has the cage disintigrated?
[4] Any signs of excessive heat?
Bearings have a design life based on pre-loading values and revs.
Looks to me as if the pre-loading was wrong on that side when the diff was assembled causing premature failure. Ref the premature wheel bearing failure fiasco -pre- loading down from370kn down to 230kn!!!
Had exactly the same problem with my d3 at 20,000 miles. When dismantled the bearing disintigrated with some force according to the dealer (not 100 miles from you)
So stick to your guns if you are of the opinon that it is a manufacturing fault-to much wriggling by warranty companies. Probably the reply will be along the lines of "this cannot happen as the units are all built by machines" Aye right Jimmy.
9th Aug 2013 9:04 am
Disco_Mikey
Member Since: 29 May 2007
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 20822
john watson wrote:
D_M need a bit more info
[1] are the bearings both sides from the same manufacturer? If so who? I would have expected something like "Timken"
[2] Any nasties in the oil?
[3] Has the cage disintigrated?
[4] Any signs of excessive heat?
Both bearings are made by Timken
Oil was a grey/silver colour, with no lumps of gears
Member Since: 10 Nov 2011
Location: lanark
Posts: 966
D_M
that would suggest to me either
wrong pre-load on assembly or improper heat teatment of the taper rollers allowing them to wear excessively. It only takes one to break down and the rest begin to break up.
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