DISCO3.CO.UK - View topic - Automatic Transmission Fluid ATF

redjelly5000

Member Since: 18 Jul 2008
Location: Rugby
Posts: 473

2008 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Auto Buckingham Blue

Automatic Transmission Fluid ATF

Have spent hours researching this subject, and have finally found a suitable fluid for your auto boxes. I need to change mine, as I have the infamous juddering on acceleration, and so I went on the hunt.

I found that the Carlube ATF-U (about Â£4 per ltr from Euro Car Parts) although it is probably a suitable replacement and some users have reported it works fine, is NOT an equivalent match for the genuine fluid. I emailed Carlube (Tetrosyl) directly and their tech guys came back to me and said that it DOES NOT meet the Shell ATF M1375.4 specification that LR specify.

After more digging I have found a product that WILL do the job. Petro-Canada are the worlds largest supplier of ATF, and they supply initial fill fluids for most of the worlds car manufacturers. I wrote to their tech guys also, and they said their DuraDrive ATF product meets and far exceeds the M1375.4 specification, and even went on to say that it would outlast the Shell stuff that LR sell.

They sent me the PDF spec sheets for this product, and they also gave me details of the UK supplier, who I contacted today, and ordered myself some. These guys were very knowledgeable, and probably the most friendly people I've dealt with in a long time. For those of you who are sceptical about the DuraDrive product, these folks are also Shell distributors as well as Petro-Canada, and they can supply you with the very same stuff you get from LR if you want to pay the extra.

THE BEST BIT:
Petro-Canada DuraDrive, from these guys is less than a fiver per litre! This includes vat, but not delivery. Delivery will be Â£12, for either a 12 ltr order (enough for 2 flushes and a refill) or a 20 ltr order (enough for 4 flushes and a refill!) Although you will pay a few pence more for the smaller order (per litre). Buy even more, and the order becomes even cheaper, so if you club together....

Anyone who would like the tech specs PDF's or the contact details for the UK distributor, PM me your email address and I'll let you have it. D3 TDV6 HSE 2008 Buckingham Blue (current)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2009 Zermatt Silver (previous)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2005 Maya Gold (previous)
D2 TD5 ES 1999 (previous)
Defender TD5 swb hard top 2005 (previous)
Defender 300tdi swb hard top 1994 (previous)

Last edited by redjelly5000 on 11th Feb 2010 1:19 pm. Edited 1 time in total

11th Feb 2010 1:15 pm

John C

Member Since: 28 Aug 2007
Location: East Yorkshire
Posts: 3292

2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Auto Cairns Blue

Re: Automatic Transmission Fluid ATF

Great work

{edit - forget the other bit - misread your post} 2020 SDV6 D5 HSE, Carpathian Grey +
2022 Tesla Model Y LR... almost Carpathian Grey
Previously : 2005 TDV6 SE Auto, Cairns Blue (288K) - ours for 16 years

11th Feb 2010 1:18 pm

gtrhaggart

Member Since: 15 Nov 2009
Location: cambs
Posts: 87

2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Auto Buckingham Blue

I have found atf-u fine but its good to have another alternative.

Lets face it the genuine stuff cant be that good cos so many people are having trouble even at lower milages.

11th Feb 2010 9:00 pm

redjelly5000

Member Since: 18 Jul 2008
Location: Rugby
Posts: 473

gtrhaggart wrote:
Lets face it the genuine stuff cant be that good cos so many people are having trouble even at lower milages.

So much for "sealed for life" eh?

Hope fully these fluids that are better engineered will do a better job and last longer. I'm sure there must be loads of fluids that will do the job just fine, but it's an expensive job if you get the wrong one, so it's nice to have the manaufacturer tell you it meets spec I suppose. D3 TDV6 HSE 2008 Buckingham Blue (current)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2009 Zermatt Silver (previous)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2005 Maya Gold (previous)
D2 TD5 ES 1999 (previous)
Defender TD5 swb hard top 2005 (previous)
Defender 300tdi swb hard top 1994 (previous)

11th Feb 2010 9:36 pm

DingMark

Member Since: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Perth Oz or Erbil, Iraq
Posts: 388

2010 Discovery 4 3.0 TDV6 HSE Auto Ipanema Sand

"Sealed for life" seems to translate to "When it dies, the seal is broken" or "doesn't blow seals unless dead" but no more

That said, the new transmissions are amazing and when powering up to 6 tonnes things can go out of whak. There is of course a change schedule in the PDF maintenance checklist. Practically speaking no hydrocarbon fluid, which is inevitably prone to oxidation and chemical change, won't last forever. It seems to me that manufacturers ought to be honest and just say the transmission is "sealed" and hence there's no fluid level gauge, not "sealed for life". Jim Dowell - D4 HSE TDi, 12,000 hydraulic winch & hidden winch mount, MTRs, TyreDog, Traxide 2 x aux battery system, fixed air compressor, Dolium roof rack, MitchHitch.
RIP 2005 D3 HSE V8 5 seater gold (stolen and torched)

12th Feb 2010 2:27 am

redjelly5000

Member Since: 18 Jul 2008
Location: Rugby
Posts: 473

I've sent the details out to so very many of you guys now, and the requests still keep on coming in, so having realised that I can upload the PDF's to my gallery I have done so, and the links are below:

http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/use...ADRIVE.pdf

http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/use..._Users.pdf

Should save me having to keep emailing it to you! I would add that I did mine about 30k miles ago now, and it's been perfect ever since. It solved my problem and no looking back!

Nigel Hall @ Lubrications Ltd, is the guy you need to speak to, and the number is 01530 833 899. They do have a website, but this product is not on it, so you need to speak to him.

He quoted me 95 for 20 ltrs, or 65 for 12 ltrs + delivery. They have barrels too if you are joint buying. I bought a barrel, did a double flush, and still had enough left to sell it on.

This was the email I received from Petro Canada along with the PDF tech specs:

We are in receipt of your enquiry.

Can confirm DURADRIVE will meet with your specifications as an alternative to SHELL ATF M1375
Please find attached Technical Data
Please also note although hardly anyone knows this - Petro-Canada Lubricants are the largest supliers of ATF Globally and we supply initial fill to Ford, GM,Chrysler and most of the Asian Automotive manufacturers.
If you have any doubts and require the Shell product then please contact Nigel Hall at Lubrication Ltd in Coalville Leicester - he is a Shell and Petro- Canada Distributor and could help you with the Shell grade

Kind Regards

John
John Cliff
Technical Manager
Suncor Energy Products Inc
Petro-Canada Europe Lubricants
e-mail jcliff@suncor.com
mobile +44 (0) 788 431 0665
tel +44 (0) 1663 763553
fax +44 (0) 1663 762147 D3 TDV6 HSE 2008 Buckingham Blue (current)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2009 Zermatt Silver (previous)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2005 Maya Gold (previous)
D2 TD5 ES 1999 (previous)
Defender TD5 swb hard top 2005 (previous)
Defender 300tdi swb hard top 1994 (previous)

3rd Sep 2011 1:52 pm

KOOS BEST

Member Since: 14 Feb 2010
Location: Mtunzini
Posts: 122

2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 S Auto Alaska White

Hi , I have just received an e mail from Petro Canada regarding their oil.

I am sorry to inform you that the Petro-Canada DuraDrive MV Synthetic ATF does NOT meet the Shell spec that you refer to, the 1375.4. It is one of only a small handful of specs which it is not suitable for use in. That particular spec is very stringent due to specific metallurgy in the transmission.

Thank you for your question.

Warm Regards,
Ken Humphries, CLS

Sr. Technical Service Advisor
Petro-Canada America Lubricants, Inc.
A Suncor Energy Company
(513) 769-4392
KHumphries@suncor.com

On another note, why ZF lifeguard6 which is produced by Shell as ATF 1375.4 is so important , it doesn't conduct electricity, which is VERY important for the 6HP26 Transmission ECU. Other oils do conduct electricity.
This according to BMW forums

Now I am confused, very confused

, seems the same company,have different opinions about their product.
What worries me , I asked about who their distributors are in Africa and about the oil than I got a complete different answer from the previous post

8th Nov 2011 6:27 am

redjelly5000

Member Since: 18 Jul 2008
Location: Rugby
Posts: 473

Well it certainly seems odd that their Technical Manager and their Technical service advisor would have differing opinions. I'm not sure where you go from here, unless you copy both emails to them and let them fight out who is actually right. I'm a little surprised you asked them, given that their technical manager had already given his advice, but on the other hand, if this genuinely is not suitable, then it may be good that it has come to light.

I would say however that I have been using this in mine for upwards of 40k miles now, and it has been better than ever before. I also know of many other users who are using this spec too, and I have been inundated with requests for the info (prior to posting it on here) so a lot of people must be using it by now, and I haven't read any problems so far. D3 TDV6 HSE 2008 Buckingham Blue (current)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2009 Zermatt Silver (previous)
D3 TDV6 HSE 2005 Maya Gold (previous)
D2 TD5 ES 1999 (previous)
Defender TD5 swb hard top 2005 (previous)
Defender 300tdi swb hard top 1994 (previous)

Last edited by redjelly5000 on 8th Nov 2011 11:59 am. Edited 1 time in total

8th Nov 2011 11:54 am

KOOS BEST

Member Since: 14 Feb 2010
Location: Mtunzini
Posts: 122

Yes , I also don"t know where too from here.
I have asked this question to Petro Canada cause I didn't see this post, I only discovered it afterwards , I saw the DURADRIVE oil somewhere else on one of the ATF post.

I did send an e mail to both of them, waiting for a reply, hopefully two heads at Petro Canada together will give us the final JAY OR NAY.
I just hope between them we do get a final verdict.

Will keep you informed.

Regards

8th Nov 2011 12:11 pm

Bushwanderer

Member Since: 27 Nov 2007
Location: Northern Rivers, NSW, Australia
Posts: 2050

2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 S Manual Buckingham Blue

Hi Koos,
If I were you, I would err on the side of caution and NOT use it. While others are and haven't noticed any problems YET, corrosion may be occurring on the transmission innards and you wont realise until it's too late.

HTH,
Peter The Bearded Dragon

9th Nov 2011 12:34 am

wvlenthe

Member Since: 07 Jan 2009
Location: Arnhem
Posts: 1967

2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Zermatt Silver

As ZF suggest using the ZF LifeGuard 6 and they are the manufacturer, this would be the safe way to go in my opinion, even if it is at higher cost. With the 80K or 100K km interval *my* LR dealer suggests, you will hardly notice the extra â‚¬ 100 per filling over the lifetime service costs of the car (works out to â‚¬ 0,001 per km).

I admit happily that â‚¬ 100 is better not spent if not necessary, or rather to be spent on other things, but it is a no-brainer in terms of warranty.

redjelly5000 wrote:
So much for "sealed for life" eh?

Well, no, it is exactly as advertised... no need to open it until the gearbox breaks.

Another question though: I found this document stating that the oil capacity of this box is 10 litres. In one of the above posts it is said that 12 litres will be enough for 3 fillings (2xflush + refill)... just as a matter of interest: how much does actually go in?

regards,

Wiljo D3 V8 HSE Auto in Zermatt silver - driveway version gone but not forgotten, only the living room cupboard version remains

9th Nov 2011 6:36 pm

KOOS BEST

Member Since: 14 Feb 2010
Location: Mtunzini
Posts: 122

I have received an E mail , from Ken Humphries, awaiting the rest as promised.

I stand with my comment. I contacted Mr. Cliff and I believe he went back and confirmed the information I reviewed and is planning on contacting you directly. I also believe he is retracting the post.
Please do not use the DuraDrive in that transmission. It just so happens that I received a call from a distributor who had made a recommendation without consulting me for a BMW 740i and it was fine for the 1st 2 months and then developed problems.

Have a great day!
Warm Regards,
Ken Humphries, CLS
Sr. Tech Svc Advisor
Petro-Canada America
513-769-4392

So , DON'T use the DURADRIVE MV in your gearbox, until further notice.
Stay with SHELL 1375.4 or ZF Lifeguard 6

10th Nov 2011 12:17 pm

caverD3

Member Since: 02 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922

2012 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 SE Auto Fuji White

Do not use any ATF that does not meet the Shell spec (there are not many that do) We have had some failures in Oz of transmissions using Penrite ATF, Penrite were saying it was ok but ZF told them it was not, they have since ammended there list to show it is not suitable. â€œThere are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.

11th Nov 2011 2:05 am

Mike767

Member Since: 15 Oct 2008
Location: Congleton, Cheshire.
Posts: 138

2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Auto Lugano Teal

I was about to go with the Duradrive ATF to sort out my gearbox shudder (82K miles, not arduous use). I typed in M1375.4 equivalent and found this on a BMW forum.

This is for the USA but it specifically states that this fluid meets with the spec of Shell M1375.4. I will try to find out if this ATF fluid is available here in the UK.

http://www.castrol.com/liveassets/bp_inter...portMV.pdf

Go to the second page, Land Rover is on the list.

11th Nov 2011 9:05 am

John C

Member Since: 28 Aug 2007
Location: East Yorkshire
Posts: 3292

Interesting

Don't forget there's a difference between the Petro Canada Duradrive, (which is apparently/I think a Ford Mercron fluid) and their heavy duty synthetic base fluid which they say is fully compatible with the OEM fluid

I've the heavy duty fluid in mine as sorted by the excellent 4-Tech as have countless others

2020 SDV6 D5 HSE, Carpathian Grey +
2022 Tesla Model Y LR... almost Carpathian Grey
Previously : 2005 TDV6 SE Auto, Cairns Blue (288K) - ours for 16 years

11th Nov 2011 9:45 am