Member Since: 29 Jul 2020
Location: Kirchstetten
Posts: 96
Fire under the hood
Hi
A short introduction:
My name is Roland, and I'm from Austria. I’m an mechanical engineer and love to work on cars as a hobby. I used to have some RRC , Landcruiser, Pajeros and so on.
Approx. 2 Months ago I bought a 2006 HSE D3 with the 2,7l engine.
My wife fell in love with it instantly. and doesn't want to miss it anymore.
I know how "intense" a land rover can be, but I like the car too. The enormous space inside and the ride comfort is really good.
We bought it as an Family car. No offroadtrips are planned. We just need a big car with all wheel drive because we live on a hill which is a pain in the a.. during wintertime.
The start with the car was a little bit rough…… I had to change the injectors right at the beginning.
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And I found a lot of rust on the rear body.
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I managed to fix all of that.
And my wife still loves that car. Even with the extra cost for the injectors and the rust-work.
BUT!
Last week it catched fire under the hood. I really don’t know why.
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All the plastic parts and wires on the left cylinder row where on fire. By luck a friend of mine had an fire extinguisher in the car.
It doesn’t seem that the fire startet at the turbo……it looks like it was really just up at the injectors.
Strange thing. Didn’t thought that it could get hot enough up there for a real fire.
However, now I’m investigating what started the fire, and how much is really damaged.
The engine and the injectors where completely dry before I started the trip. Maybe a return-piping got broken? But, I don’t think that this are gets hot enough to ignite diesel.
Whats your opinion on this case? What could have caused the fire?
And second point…is it possible to replace the engine wiring harness without removing the body?
Or should I remove the body anyway?
Best regards
Roland
14th Sep 2020 1:01 pm
nigethecat
Member Since: 11 Sep 2016
Location: Marnoch
Posts: 4241
Firstly congrats on the new purchase and secondly sympathies due to the fire, it was very fortunate that your friend had a fire extinguisher close by, (ALWAYS, ALWAYS carry one in the car).
I can't help with the technical questions but it looks like you got away very lightly... someone who knows things will be along shortly I want to see the sweets before I get into your windowless van... I'm not stupid!
Corris Grey D4 Commercial SE 2016
Zermatt Sliver 2007 D3 SE manual (gone)
Indus Silver D4 HSE 2015 (gone)
Bonatti Grey D3 HSE 2006 (gone)
White D3 S (LHD) 2007 (gone)
Firenze Red D4 HSE 2014 (gone)
Black RRS 3.6TDV8 2008 (gone)
Rusty Green Defender 110 1997 (gone)
Black FL2 HSE 2013 (gone)
14th Sep 2020 1:21 pm
rrhool
Member Since: 28 Aug 2014
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 4517
If you have disconnected the injectors to do your flow measurement, could it be that you left a joint loose, or disturbed the leak off pipes, which can be a problem even without disturbing them.Richard
D3 SE 2007. Triumph 2.5Pi 1973. Ferguson TEA20 1948.
Discovery 2 4.0 ES 2001- Gone
Discovery 1 300Tdi ES '95 - Gone
Range Rover Classic '79 - Gone
14th Sep 2020 1:48 pm
Pete K
Member Since: 15 Jan 2016
Location: GL
Posts: 10673
You aren’t the only one to have fire problems.
There is a recall. I think it’s the hip fuel pump at the rear of the engine (top) sochave a look there.
Yours looks hot at the front ? If an EGR gets stuck open that can result in it getting hot on that pipe at the front. That seams more likely.
No I wouldnt remove body.
Last edited by Pete K on 14th Sep 2020 2:56 pm. Edited 1 time in total
14th Sep 2020 2:49 pm
Pete K
Member Since: 15 Jan 2016
Location: GL
Posts: 10673
Pete K wrote:
just found this
Reference : R/2009/051
Manufacturer Ref : P008
Make: LAND ROVER
Model : Discovery 3 and Range Rover Sport
Launch Date : 28/09/2009 Numbers Involved : 13275
Build Start Date : 01/09/2006
Build End Date : 30/11/2006
Recall Details Concern : FUEL MAY LEAK
Description : Fuel may leak from the fuel pump front bearing which could lead to poor performance, smell of fuel, fuel leakage at the rear of the engine, fuel leak onto the ground and in the worse case fire.
Remedial Action : Recall the vehicles that are likely to be affected to replace the high pressure fuel pump, drive belt, belt tensioner, the high pressure fuel lines and the fuel filter.
Vehicle Id :
SALLAAA137A412125 to SALLAAA177A424188
SALLAAA137A435285 to SALLAAA178A450620
SALLAAA138A457150 to SALLAAA138A476102
SALLSAA137A109823 to SALLSAA138A130317
SALLSAA138A138781 to SALLSAA138A166694
SALLSAA137A980310 to SALLSAA137A995711
More likely with being disturbed that one of the spill back pipes has come off or broken, it does not take long to heat up the fuel if its running down to the turbo or the exhaust.
Did you also fit new injector copper seals when you had them out. ?
Flack
14th Sep 2020 5:19 pm
darrind
Member Since: 04 Jul 2008
Location: In A World of My Own!
Posts: 2889
Leak offs can put a lot of fuel onto the engine in a short space of time, I have replaced the whole hose assembly in the past as one just wouldnt sit right and was leaking slightly
I also later suffered an engine fire but it was caused by an EGR stuck open on the Right hand side.
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Fortunately I was able to put it out before any terminal damage!
If you look on the left inlet there were flames coming out and the Y peice and RHS inlet were completely distorted. The swirl flaps on the undersides of the inlet were burned and it was a close run thing, especially as it started as I was coming off the motorway for fuel, could have been much worse if it was burning next to fuel pump on the garage forecourt!Must stop buying shiny toys....
14th Sep 2020 6:14 pm
Fuxl
Member Since: 29 Jul 2020
Location: Kirchstetten
Posts: 96
Hi
I removed the EGR couple of weeks ago. So that’s not the reason.
And there is definitely no fire damage down at the turbo or the exhaust. Maybe it ignited just some fuel which burned afterwards up at the injectors.
after i installed the new injectors, there was really a leaking return pipe. I fixed it and checked it every day. There was definitely no leak in the morning of this day.
Copper sealings are new.
I’m quite new to this car, so, where is the fuel-pump-front-bearing which could cause fire?
My guess at the moment:
A return pipe broke, or a high pressure fitting got loose. The area around the injectors filled up with fuel, some of it dripped down to the exhaust, ignited there and started the fire at the top.
The car arrived yesterday evening at home. I just had a quick glance. The whole injector area is covered in melted plastic. it will take some time to remove this carefully. I hope I will find some glues beneath it why this happened.
Overall it doesn’t look so bad. the wiring seems more or less ok. I think it’s enough to repair it locally. Some tubes and pipes are gone. The “intake manifold” on the left bank doesn’t look quite good. As well as the plastic belt cover on the front of the engine.
On the rear of the left bank is a pressure regulator? Or something similar? Couldn’t identify it now.
It’s also gone
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15th Sep 2020 6:27 am
Pete K
Member Since: 15 Jan 2016
Location: GL
Posts: 10673
The fuel pump is at the rear of engine.
Not far from your blue circle.
Yeah you will need a cam cover.
Intake Y
15th Sep 2020 7:48 am
Dondiddy
Member Since: 26 Dec 2019
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 309
The leaking fuel pump problem mentioned in the bulletin is unlikely to be an issue on this vehicle as the affected VIN range are all RHD and I`m assuming as being in Austria this is a LHD vehicle. As the vehicle has previously had work done on the pipes/injectors then a leak there is the most probable cause I would think as these pipes can be very difficult to get to seal again if they have been slackened due to the extremely high fuel pressures. I believe that LR specify that new pipes must be fitted if they are slackened for any reason but most people will just reuse them and in most cases there won`t be an issue. Hopefully the damage won`t be too bad once all the melted plastic is out the way. Obviously a leaking pipe should show up once the engine is running again!
15th Sep 2020 8:06 am
Fuxl
Member Since: 29 Jul 2020
Location: Kirchstetten
Posts: 96
Hi
I found some time to dissemble the engine bay partly.
Still I couldn't find any reason for the fire. all leak oil fittings are still connected and secured with the clip.
the high pressure pipes where tightly connected.
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anyway. I'm now working on a list which parts I should buy new.
inlet manifold for sure
timing belt cover
3 injectors
timing belt front
timing belt rear
auxiliary belt
leak oil tubes
high pressure tube
high pressure tube from pump to rail (had to remove it)
Many cables and connectors
I will also do all 6 glow plugs
and the oil pump (read that I should do it with the timing belts)
Any other suggestions? What to do?
Is it possible to remove the EGR cooling tubes? EGR is blanked anyway, and I heard of some water leaks inside the EGR cooler. It would give me some more space under the hood. This machine is so packed with tubes and pipes and stuff that I ‘m happy to remove anything not really needed to make life easier.
best regards
Roland
22nd Sep 2020 1:49 pm
Pete K
Member Since: 15 Jan 2016
Location: GL
Posts: 10673
Best to leave the EGRs present.
I wouldn’t be bothering with a new cam cover until it was running again.
22nd Sep 2020 3:48 pm
Fuxl
Member Since: 29 Jul 2020
Location: Kirchstetten
Posts: 96
Hi
Finally, it's running again!
It wasn't easy to get all the burned parts for a reasonable price. There are almost no used parts here in Austria.
I also replaced all the glow plugs during the repair. 5 of them cracked.
One of them cracked 3 TIMES when I used the "special removing tool".
In the end only the Tip remained inside
It wasn't easy to get that one out without removing the head.
I also removed all the EGR cooling hoses, tubes and the EGR valves themself.
No issues so far. just disconected the valves. there is a error stored, but no warning lights on the dash.....so i guess its ok.
During the whole repair I couldn't find any reason for the fire. All the hoses where ok. All the high pressure tubes where tightly secured.
I'm using them again. No leaks so far.
best regards
Roland
16th Nov 2020 10:08 am
joness7
Member Since: 09 Feb 2006
Location: West London
Posts: 233
Well done!!
That looks like a lot of perseverance, patience and a big dollop of skill/know-how. I wouldn't know where to start.2018 1.5Ti Skoda Octavia - dull as f&ck
2019 D5 SdV6 SE Anniversary - black/black - good riddance!!
2010 D4 TDV6 HSE - Nara Bronze with black - now gone!!
2006 D3 TDV6 HSE - Buckingham Blue with Alpaca - now gone!!
BMW R1200GS - also blue, also gone!!
Honda CRF1000L Africa Twin DCT - Dakar colours
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16th Nov 2020 10:39 am
Iguana
Member Since: 14 Oct 2013
Location: 'Sunny' Zomerset
Posts: 9424
Tremendous news @Fuxi Iggy/Ieuan
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