Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
Front End Tensioners
I've just recieved PQH500130 & PQG500250 I ordered from a seller on Amazon(Autodoc).
Whilst ordering, the images indicated it was INA / Schaeffler Parts.
Upon recieving I noticed Schaeffler boxes, but products inside have Litens embossed on them.
The PQH500130 does not have a black coating on the pulley and seems to have milled batch numbers, making it look very very suspect in my eyes.
Is this normal, or do I send the parts back ?
TBH, I have no need for a new PQH500130, the only reason i ordered one was to have the black coating on the pulley from new, whilst thinking why not change it together when doing PQG500250 to match.
I've uploaded the images in my Gallery, haven't figured out how to post them here for ease of viewing.
I would have ideally ordered off of AF, but with customs being charged on shipping too, I'm forced to look at local alternatives.
3rd Mar 2022 1:43 pm
DN D3 Decade
Member Since: 24 Jun 2006
Location: W.London.
Posts: 2337
They don’t look like poor quality parts tbh, how do the bearings feel ? No black coating on the pulley is not a problem, in fact it may grip on the belt better.
D3 owned from new, P017 brake recall, BAS FBHIC, new FBH, LR013487 oil pump, new water pump. RRS front lower suspension arms. New suspension compressor/ relay. New Denso alternator. CuNifer rear brake pipes. New GKN rear propshaft. New HPFP belt & tensioner. New A/C Condenser.NO WARRANTY for many many years.
3rd Mar 2022 1:56 pm
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
INA / Schaeffler buys from Litens , who would have known
Thanks for those comments David, I hadn't seen them yesterday.
Yes , bearings feel fine. Still can't get my head around the number being milled and restamped/embossed though.
After some more googling, turns out that Litens does actually supply two types of Idlers.
One which is riveted(as pictured in OE) and another which uses TOX bindings(Aftermarket ?) instead.
That might explain why it looks like it does instead of looking like :
4th Mar 2022 3:31 pm
DN D3 Decade
Member Since: 24 Jun 2006
Location: W.London.
Posts: 2337
The 2nd genuine LR tensioner I fitted to mine was defective from the start, it did not exert enough spring tension on the belt, so it squealed every time I started the engine, so even genuine LR parts can be utter garbage at times D3 owned from new, P017 brake recall, BAS FBHIC, new FBH, LR013487 oil pump, new water pump. RRS front lower suspension arms. New suspension compressor/ relay. New Denso alternator. CuNifer rear brake pipes. New GKN rear propshaft. New HPFP belt & tensioner. New A/C Condenser.NO WARRANTY for many many years.
4th Mar 2022 4:25 pm
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
Ha ha, fair enough, I'm at least not paying €100/pc more for FoMoCO or Land Rover to be casted onto the piece instead of Litens.
I have written to the supplier and will update on what happens. I'm happy with Litens/Gates/INA/Dayco,all good brands
Is it worth doing both at the same time though is what i'm wondering, given I don't have any issues with my idler at the moment.
But that being said, since that both have run 247,000kms from factory fit, it'd be prudent changing it I suppose.
4th Mar 2022 9:02 pm
DN D3 Decade
Member Since: 24 Jun 2006
Location: W.London.
Posts: 2337
At that kilometerage, (is that a word ? )…I’d say they have done very well. I changed both idler and tensioner on mine at about 80,000 miles, ( approx 130,000 km) only because I could detect some bearing play. If your idler has very little bearing play, I would leave it on until you can detect some tbh. Let us know how you get on with contacting the supplier, but I don’t think you will have any issues with those parts. D3 owned from new, P017 brake recall, BAS FBHIC, new FBH, LR013487 oil pump, new water pump. RRS front lower suspension arms. New suspension compressor/ relay. New Denso alternator. CuNifer rear brake pipes. New GKN rear propshaft. New HPFP belt & tensioner. New A/C Condenser.NO WARRANTY for many many years.
22nd Mar 2022 2:39 am
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
Update as promised
So , turns out I needed a new Idler after all , old ones weren't a nice as I thought they would be.
I just hadn't taken the time to inspect them close enough I suppose.
They spun fine, smooth enough, had no endfloat, however were not running true vertically.
The supplier did send me replacement parts , manufactured 03/2021.
A year old, but I suppose that's ok, I'll take that.
If I were an Indy I'd make sure never to order from Autodoc.de again, my Disco was sat for a couple of weeks waiting on parts.
No issues for me an individual though as it wasn't urgent.
Hounding Customer service everyday was no fun though, I'll tell you that.
And on an unrelated note , I think it has somewhat cured the shudder I had when it was still cold.
That's on another thread I started, though i'll wait it out a bit to see if it really has.
Though initial signs are good , it pulled well uphill with 4 passengers, my snowboard and some luggage.
Fingers crossed it really has solved it.
1st Apr 2022 8:30 pm
Motolab
Member Since: 18 Oct 2019
Location: Sleen
Posts: 1820
Since you seem rather “picky” about the quality of the parts you recieved i am quite amazed you did reuse old bolts… to mount them….IMHO it is a bad idea to re use those old bolts on the belt tensioner..
They do snap sometimes if reused .. and genuine ones are not very expensive….. another engine is thoughBest regards
Harold
Always looking for Pre '55's & Pre war British Motorcycles! knowing or having one for sale? PM please. I visit the UK 6 times a year
Ps. I edit my texts quite often, english is not my native language, so I will edit My “typo’s” etc.
2nd Apr 2022 12:43 am
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
Hi Harold,
Yes you're right , I was wondering if these should be fitted with new bolts and why they weren't supplied along with.
In either case like you said, it's a good idea to replace them along with the tensioners.
But that being said, Haynes Manual says nothing about this being a one time use only bolt, it says 47Nm, and that's that.
Haynes does say that the Tensioner bolt for timing at 25Nm is one time use only.
But I don't think I understand what you mean about a new engine.
If the bolt snaps, it then takes out the drive for the auxiliary belt which runs the A/C , Power steering, Alternator and viscous fan units. Why do you say another engine.
I'm actually happy to pick new bolts up as well if it is prudent.
Just don't have the part numbers. Like you say, it is cheap insurance to pick them up.
Would you happen to know the part numbers i'd need to pick up ?
2nd Apr 2022 3:35 pm
aja4x4
Member Since: 14 Apr 2019
Location: Westbury
Posts: 2463
I think Harold is getting mixed up with the timing belt tensioners, which should always have new bolts.
I have reused the serpentine belt tensioner bolts again when doing timing belts but if you are going to the expence of replacing the serpentine belt and tensioners its worth spending that little extra.Andrew
D3 2.7tdv6 2005
D4 3.0 SDV6 Commercial died and gone to LR heaven
D5 3.0 SDV6 HSE
2nd Apr 2022 3:58 pm
DN D3 Decade
Member Since: 24 Jun 2006
Location: W.London.
Posts: 2337
I think the genuine LR tensioner, and possibly the idler pulley, come with new bolts. Don’t forget that the aux belt also drives the water pump, so if you didn’t notice a failure fairly promptly, you could easily cook the engine D3 owned from new, P017 brake recall, BAS FBHIC, new FBH, LR013487 oil pump, new water pump. RRS front lower suspension arms. New suspension compressor/ relay. New Denso alternator. CuNifer rear brake pipes. New GKN rear propshaft. New HPFP belt & tensioner. New A/C Condenser.NO WARRANTY for many many years.
2nd Apr 2022 4:29 pm
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
I think i'd immediately notice the loss of power steering much before it ever comes to cooking the engine.
A 3 ton car without power steering is a drive straight into the hedge i'd reckon .
Yes, probably genuine ones do, mine are OEM parts though.
No idea why they came without a bolt, they weren't pictured with one either. So that's fair play.
I've been scouring the internet to check if i can find a part number for the bolts.
No luck as yet. I guess I'll give a call to the local Landy spares dept and ask them for the bolt that gets supplied along with PQG500250 and PQH500130.
There's a good chance they're going to tell me that they do not sell them seperately.
In the meanwhile if any of you gents do know the part numbers for the bolts, I would be very thankful, so that I can buy new one right away and drive in peace.
Failing which I can always buy an 8.8 rated M10 bolt of similar length from any store I suppose.
2nd Apr 2022 4:47 pm
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
Right, so called up LR Dealership PQG500250 is sold as a full kit and the Bolt cannot be sourced seperately since it doesn't seem to have a part number, not one they can see at least.
I am now thinking of contacting other eBay companies to see if they'll sell me one.
Does anyone know the bolt length ? (Of course I can disassemble mine and measure worst case)
From memory it was an M10, though don't know if it was 8.8 or 10.9 Grade.
12th Apr 2022 12:22 pm
DN D3 Decade
Member Since: 24 Jun 2006
Location: W.London.
Posts: 2337
Hi shravan, Just dug out my old tensioner bolt, on the head is marked SFT 9.8. It is an M10 thread, but the plain part of the shank appears to be 9mm diameter. Full length measured from under the head of the bolt is 68mm, ( 28mm of that is plain shank). Hope that helps. D3 owned from new, P017 brake recall, BAS FBHIC, new FBH, LR013487 oil pump, new water pump. RRS front lower suspension arms. New suspension compressor/ relay. New Denso alternator. CuNifer rear brake pipes. New GKN rear propshaft. New HPFP belt & tensioner. New A/C Condenser.NO WARRANTY for many many years.
12th Apr 2022 3:28 pm
shravanjk86
Member Since: 20 Jun 2019
Location: Düsseldorf
Posts: 52
Thank you
Tob Job David, , Thanks a ton , helps me quite a bit to narrow down the search.
Will let the old Bolt on for another month whilst trying to source the correct LR/OE Bolt, if not i'll use your measurement and try to get a standard off the shelf Bolt.
Though I have to admit 9.8Grade Bolts are uncommon , they're usually 8.8 or 10.9, and a lot of the images i've seen suggest it is suplied with a 10.9Grade Bolt.
I'll bet the 28mm long 9mm plain shank is just for slipping across the tensioner length before actual thread engagement on the Alternator mounting bracket.
So even if I end up with M10 in those sections I should be fine.
Thanks,
Shravan
Edit : A quick google leads me to a Ford Part number , which makes sense since this is a FORD engine.
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