Member Since: 21 Dec 2013
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 11
Not the battery after all
My D3 has to be jump started every day to start it. I have had the battery and alternator checked, both appear 100%. I also had them check the drain but it was well under an amp. Seriously getting naffed with it now. :
I have a suspension fault, amber, normal ride hight only. Fine when I start up, a few seconds later, ping and it's on again. Wondering if this could be related as both happened about the same time.
Today the flat battery clicking agin. Not even enough juice to show dash lights after first turn of the key. Then decided to check battery before jumping it and it appears to be fine and fully charged. started with a jump though. Seriously confused now. Still charging off alternator at +14.5 Volts. But seems flat a few mins after cutting the engine? Going to disconnect pos terminal next time I leave it and hope this doesn't cause other problems until I can get it to the shop in new year. Any advice would be appreciated. Not had any faults for last ten months.
Thanks in advance
Selous
Selous
22nd Dec 2013 3:32 pm
Dave^
Member Since: 23 Jun 2013
Location: West Yorks
Posts: 706
When you say you've had the battery tested.... how was it tested and what with?
My battery was down to half it's stated CCA, but always showed 12.5v on the multimeter...flickr
22nd Dec 2013 3:37 pm
Robbie
Member Since: 05 Feb 2006
Location: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posts: 17932
Quote:
I also had them check the drain but it was well under an amp.
This bit worried me a little as even a large quiescent drain would be under an Amp!
A 2005 should take 20 mins to go to sleep and draw less than 20mA.
Do you know what it was actually drawing and what the battery voltages were - we need real numbers to help?
Land Rover - Turning Drivers into Mechanics Since 1948
Member Since: 23 Aug 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 10564
As Robbie said an amp seems alot to me. Has the battery been properlley tested, just putting a meter across it does not prove the battery is not shot, need to do a proper drop (LOAD)test on it.MY17 D5 1st Edition Namib Orange
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22nd Dec 2013 4:14 pm
Adigorn
Member Since: 14 Mar 2010
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 546
How old is the battery?
+1 to How did you test it?
22nd Dec 2013 4:17 pm
Robbie
Member Since: 05 Feb 2006
Location: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posts: 17932
The bottom line is that batteries that are genuinely good one day should be good the next. Either the battery is duff or the car is pulling it down overnight. There are no other options.
20mA = 0.02 Amps.
As an example, my 2005 HSE pulled a maximum of 0.013 Amps when tucked up for the night.
Land Rover - Turning Drivers into Mechanics Since 1948
Member Since: 21 Dec 2013
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 11
Thanks for the feed back all.
Ironically the last time it wouldn't start, a matter of hours ago, I was in halfords in Mansfield. So they tested it, amps, volts and under load once I'd jumped it. Thus I don't have the exact details. I just called the shop and spoke to the lad who tells me he remembers the drain ( earth lead off lug) at 0.35 The Landy had been stood for under ten mins. Usually I can leave it 3 to 6 hours and it still starts but on the latter timing it sounded as though, had it not started first turn of the key, it probably wouldn't have started. I switch off everything before switch off and she wouldn't have been asleep due to time, I would assume. Having to leave it running all time as I dare not switch off until I get back to base. Barry
22nd Dec 2013 4:25 pm
Selous
Member Since: 21 Dec 2013
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 11
Battery is just about two years old
22nd Dec 2013 4:27 pm
Robbie
Member Since: 05 Feb 2006
Location: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posts: 17932
Ok 0.35 would be a terrible drain but after just 10 mins the car would not be asleep, so the figure is actually meaningless. I think we should consider the car untested for a parasitic draw.
Do you own a multimeter?Land Rover - Turning Drivers into Mechanics Since 1948
Member Since: 14 Mar 2010
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 546
Quote:
Do you own a multimeter?
+ is tailgate switch working as it should
22nd Dec 2013 4:34 pm
Selous
Member Since: 21 Dec 2013
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 11
Thanks Robbie. I agree. I shall look up how to do this. I think I saw something on the forum about it. Seriously need to sort this out and find a decent mechanic. Have an electrical guy who's come very highly recommended but he can't get me in until lend of jan
Finding an air suspension specialist is harder. The ones with the big green sigh seem to think money is just a random phone number with £ sign in front
22nd Dec 2013 4:37 pm
Robbie
Member Since: 05 Feb 2006
Location: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posts: 17932
For a start, before you look for a parasitic draw you need to check your voltages with a real multimeter. Do not be tempted by talk of diagnostic screens as only a multimeter will do:
Good battery is around 12.5v and the D3 alternator peaks at around 15.8v (which is higher than most). You should always see over 12.7v when the alternator is running but it seems to settle around 13v+. Alternator goes to full output not long after start (a few seconds) and pushes out almost full power at idle.
Reasonably new battery in rude health:
About 10 seconds after starting:
About 40 seconds after starting:
Apologies for the poor photo but about 60 seconds after starting as shown on a cheap 12v cigar socket voltmeter rather than a Fluke:
The above are pretty typical for a D3 with a good battery and good alternator. Car had not been driven for a day and temp was about 9 deg C, although it was a little colder overnight. The voltage is regulated by the cars engine management system according to load, charging rate and temperature.
Land Rover - Turning Drivers into Mechanics Since 1948
Member Since: 21 Dec 2013
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 11
Awesome Robbie I'll have a go at that wizardry tomorrow when it gets light and update. Thank you
Selous
22nd Dec 2013 4:47 pm
Robbie
Member Since: 05 Feb 2006
Location: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posts: 17932
As I live on the Lincs/Notts boarder I may not be that far away from you either.
Robbie's Battery Load Test Rule Of Thumb (other figures are out there, but these work for me) for when you do not have a battery analyser to hand.
With a multimeter in min/max mode crank the engine. Post crank use the min/max button to see what the voltage dropped to when cranking. It should be greater than the voltages below, compensated for battery temperature. For the test to be valid the battery must have a reasonable state of charge before the test starts (above 12.5v):
Electrolyte Temperature °C vs Minimum Voltage Under LOAD
38°_________________________9.9v
32°_________________________9.8v
27°_________________________9.7v
21°_________________________9.6v
16°_________________________9.5v
10°_________________________9.4v
4°__________________________9.3v
-1°_________________________9.1v
-7°_________________________8.9v
-12°________________________8.7v
-18°________________________8.5v
SoC table from drivesafe:
Click image to enlarge
Time to break-out the Fluke or other DMM.
Land Rover - Turning Drivers into Mechanics Since 1948
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started with a jump though. Seriously confused now. Still charging off alternator at +14.5 Volts. But seems flat a few mins after cutting the engine? Going to disconnect pos terminal next time I leave it and hope this doesn't cause other problems until I can get it to the shop in new year. Any advice would be appreciated. Not had any faults for last ten months.
