Member Since: 19 Feb 2014
Location: Hants
Posts: 55
Jump starting other vehicles with D4
I have read numerous reports of damage to modern car's electrical systems that can result from jump starting other vehicles. Does the D4 suffer from this and if so is there a correct procedure?
(I have a Caterham 7 that needs the occasional jump so not huge in load but also wondered about others)
Cheers.
20th Mar 2014 12:59 pm
Maxarn58
Member Since: 24 Dec 2011
Location: Sollentuna, north of Stockholm
Posts: 225
Mr McBreadhead..
I have had some experience with jumpstarting other vehicles, and
I can give You this piece of advice:
Before attemting to jumpstart, make sure that BOTH vehicles are
shut off (key out of ignition).
1. Attach the red jumpcable (+12V) from your car to the "startee"
(all is safe, since the circuit is not closed)
2. Attach the black cable (ground), first onYour car, then on the
"startee" (Now the circuit is closed an the red cable is "live")
3. Start Your engine, wait for a minute or two, then attempt to
start the other vehicle.
4. If it starts, let the cables be attached for a few minutes, to ensure that
the other car really is running ok.
5 . If all is running smoothly, then it is ok to disconnect.
FIRST disconnect the black cable (ground) from the car you helped, THEN from Your own.
Now the red cable is safe to disconnect, it can not make any shortcircuits, so disconnect it from
the other car, and then from your own.
This procedure should prevent any mishaps, shortcircuits and other things that can occur.
This method should be used on all sorts of cars, both with and without databoxes..
I hope that this is helpful to You and others.
Best regards
UffeRRS MY2006 HST
As a rule, I always resist temptations,
unless they are irresistible!!
20th Mar 2014 2:21 pm
nighthawk
Member Since: 24 Jul 2010
Location: Malta
Posts: 1163
I'm no expert, and I understand the idea behind that process, but I wouldn't be very comfortable with that method. I personally want the "good" vehicle with the engine running before attaching jump leads. Not sure how happy the good battery will be trying to feed a few hundred amps into the flat battery, run the glow plugs, fuel pump, ECU startup routines etc etc, AND pump a few other hundred amps into the starter motor, all at the same time.
I'd be very scared I'd end up with 2 non-starting vehicles Dennis
2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Commercial Manual Buckingham Blue
20th Mar 2014 2:42 pm
MarsKy
Member Since: 23 Dec 2011
Location: Lanarkshire
Posts: 847
Paraphrased instructions on my Clarke booster cables for Car A starting Car B:
1. Both cars have engine off
2. Car A +ve (red) to Car B +ve (red)
3. Car A -ve (black) to engine block and as far away as possible from the battery
4. Start Car A, wait for it to tick over, wait a couple of minutes then start Car B
5. Do not continuously crank for periods longer than 10-15 seconds
6. After Car B starts, keep both engines running
7. Then remove -ve (black) from engine block
8. Remove -ve (black) from Car A
9. Remove +ve (red) from Car A
10. Remove +ve (red) from Car B
20th Mar 2014 3:11 pm
BrianT
Member Since: 17 Nov 2009
Location: Ayrshire
Posts: 2069
I don't think that is what the OP is after,i believe he is curious over where to attach the leads,IIRC for a D4 it states not to connect the -VE to the battery but to a good earth point on the chassis/body.
I do stand to be corrected.
BrianT MY 16 Landmark Santorini Black
MY 05 SE Adriatic Blue (Gone but not forgotten)
20th Mar 2014 3:16 pm
WINDSWEPTISLANDER
Member Since: 21 Jul 2011
Location: Way up north
Posts: 523
Is there anything mentioned in the handbook?
I find the D3 to be the best vehicle I have had for starting other cars (+ boats). A notable instance was when we were trying to start a boat off a focus, it wasn't working, stuck the leads on the D3 and whoom!
I'm no sparkie, but even I know that if you connect a good battery to a dead battery you are asking for trouble.
Keep your engine running, connect first one cable, then the other taking care not to create a short, I see no reason why there should be any problems.
20th Mar 2014 3:26 pm
MarsKy
Member Since: 23 Dec 2011
Location: Lanarkshire
Posts: 847
Click image to enlarge
20th Mar 2014 3:45 pm
WINDSWEPTISLANDER
Member Since: 21 Jul 2011
Location: Way up north
Posts: 523
Very interesting Marksy, where is that from?
I still can't think why you would connect the batteries without first starting the engine, it looks to me like a recipe for two stranded vehicles. Do you think it's to - as far as possible - eliminate the risk of getting an electric shock?
Personally, I'll be keeping the 'donor vehicle' engine running from before the connection is made till after it is broken.
20th Mar 2014 11:42 pm
nighthawk
Member Since: 24 Jul 2010
Location: Malta
Posts: 1163
Same thoughts as WINDSWEPTISLANDER.
I think the idea behind that method is to avoid any electronic stuff (ECUs, etc) in the donor vehicle being damaged by the sudden voltage drop and possible spikes etc due to the "spark" when attaching the final negative cable.
However, I still believe this is risking two stranded vehicles, unless you are 101% sure the donor vehicle is 101% charged and healthy. I personally wouldn't want to try this out in the boonies on a donor vehicle with, say, a 4 year old battery, especially if it hasn't been hooked up to a CTEK for a while.
I have jump started a good few vehicles with my D3, always had the D3 running so the alternator could do a good bit of the job of charging the receiving vehicle for around 5 minutes before any starter motor came into play. I think the key is to attach the final cable cleanly and decisively, such that you get one small spark. If you drag that cable along metal stuff, or spend 10 seconds fumbling trying to get the clamp to fit well, throwing sparks all the way then yes I see the potential for problems. Damage is highly unlikely IMO. Maybe a couple of communication faults logged but I doubt any ECU will be fried.Dennis
2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Commercial Manual Buckingham Blue
21st Mar 2014 7:45 am
Scarab
Member Since: 11 Jun 2011
Location: Hastings
Posts: 1283
From Pages 248 and 249 of the Discovery 3 HandbooK
21st Mar 2014 7:45 am
nighthawk
Member Since: 24 Jul 2010
Location: Malta
Posts: 1163
Yes I am aware of the handbook advice. Handbooks are mostly written by lawyers with some tiny input from technical people, so I can understand the reasoning. The same people who wrote in the handbook that no chains should be fitted to the rear wheels under ANY circumstances but then you see LR's own vehicle fitted with chains front and rear ... http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic30528.h...+%2Bchains
If I were doing this at home it would be OK. But if I were jump starting any car with a flat battery on a freezing winter night with a storm warning on the way I'll stick to having the good car with engine running, especially if the battery wasn't bought yesterday. Yes, there MIGHT be a TINY BIT greater risk of electronic damage, but I think anyone with a basic level of intelligence can avoid this risk.
But in any case, your car, your situation. Everyone entitled to choose. Dennis
2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Commercial Manual Buckingham Blue
21st Mar 2014 9:04 am
crwoody
Member Since: 09 Mar 2009
Location: Littleborough
Posts: 2109
I always have the engine running on mine when connecting the jump cables to another car, a battery in decent condition should always have a sufficiently low internal resistance to overcome and suppress any "glitches" caused by making the connection.
I've added an Anderson connector to my D3, mounted on the front of the FBH bracket, the remote battery can be connected safely to both terminals and then plugged in to mine with no risk of causing a short, (also saves having to remove the battery cover each time.)
Safety and convenience in one package Clive
21st Mar 2014 9:26 am
Scarab
Member Since: 11 Jun 2011
Location: Hastings
Posts: 1283
Crwoody,
Would you be able to post pictures of your setup? I'm interested in something similar inspired by this image of a nice jumper cable setup from another forum:
Click image to enlarge
21st Mar 2014 9:51 am
crwoody
Member Since: 09 Mar 2009
Location: Littleborough
Posts: 2109
@ Scarab
Mine's a simple arrangement, just a bracket made from a little bit of aluminium sheet I had knocking about and fitted to the FBH support.
The positive wire from the connector goes straight to the + terminal on the battery, the neg one I've taken to a bolt just below the FBH. I keep thinking I should add a BIG in-line fuse in the +cable but I've not got around to it yet, not had a problem so far.
The jump leads are a normal set of heavy duty ones, I cut about 18" off from one end and soldered an Anderson connector to each part so I can plug them together and use them in the normal way if needed, like the ones you have pictured.
I used to have a similar arrangement in my 90 but with the connector just inside the back door, mainly because it was a right pain to get to the battery with it being under the passenger seat.
Clive
21st Mar 2014 5:08 pm
jeepmadmike
Member Since: 18 Jan 2014
Location: Devon
Posts: 270
Buy a boost pack then you don't have to worryMY14 post man pat van
70series land cruiser
1947 willys jeep
Hobby 670 motor home
And lots of other stuff in my shed, on my driveway or abandoned in the village
Several VW T5's
Mitsubishi outlander
And a Suzuki X90... Only drive that at night
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
