Member Since: 18 Oct 2008
Location: Louth
Posts: 575
2005 -v- 2007 performance
Hi All
Having recently upgraded in an unplanned fashion from a 2005 TDV6 to a 2007 TDV6 ( both manuals)
I have a few observations to make regarding performance
- the 2005 had much better acceleration off the line
- the 2005 had better fuel economy figures
- the 2005 pulled loads better ( circa. 3tonne)
- alround the 2005 was a much better engine performer
At first I just though i was being sentimental about 'Betty' and in reality there was no difference, but today a mate with a 2005 TDV6 blew me away from a standing start at the lights, and when I screwed it at the next lights, he commented on the clouds of black stuff my D3 was emitting whilst his was clean as a whistle, which kinda confirmed all my suspisions about my 2007 D3.
Before I go into my dealer farting fire about performance below expectations, is this a 2007 trait, are the performance levels of the 2007 units below 2005 levels
If this is untrue and 2007 units should be as good or improved on the 2005 units, can anyone suggest any areas that may need checking, I have done the following
1. checked and replaced air filter
2. flushed the fuel system with fuel treatment
3. changed fuel filter
all to no avail, if I go into the dealer, I would like to be able to ask for a few thing to be checked instead of being told
yeah yeah yeah we checked your car and its fine , your imagining things
Suggestions.........Nine-tenths of wisdom is being wise in time.
Last edited by BLACK BETTY on 25th Apr 2009 9:39 pm. Edited 1 time in total
25th Apr 2009 9:37 pm
Russell
Member Since: 24 Aug 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 10564
was it new if not how many mile has it done. Is it possible it needs to be given a good run and got nice and hot then drive it hard to clear it out. Could have been driven in 6th every where and needs a good clear out.MY17 D5 1st Edition Namib Orange
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25th Apr 2009 9:39 pm
MacLeod 313
Member Since: 18 Apr 2008
Location: away
Posts: 10723
Less weight, no seats back there. Are you sure you aint carrying more.
Serious note though. I did read there was a difference between the two, will try n find it for you
25th Apr 2009 9:39 pm
BLACK BETTY
Member Since: 18 Oct 2008
Location: Louth
Posts: 575
36k kms on clock
dealer had being using it as a loaner for the last year, whilst he had it on forecourt for sale, so I'm assuming that anyone that had a loan of it drove it like they stole it ( coz bramble rash on it was suggestive of the same )
personally it has recieved a few god motorway toastings to no additional benifit
Load in the VAN part is the exact same, all stowed in crates and transfered across from older VAN
I test drove a 2006 MY with about 2000m on the clock then bought a new 2007 model.
My new 2007 car with the EC4 compliant engine etc. was waaaay better on pickup and seemed smoother all round than the test model.
This seemed to be backed up by peoples opinion at the time too.
I would get it checked out.
BTW. Mine has now done 60000 miles and has never emitted black smoke as you describe.
25th Apr 2009 11:36 pm
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26705
My 2008.5 is much perkier than my old 05. Relatively frugal too. The engine note is harsher than the 05, and there is a certain buzz to it that I can sense through the vehicle.
26th Apr 2009 12:45 am
SN
Member Since: 03 Jan 2006
Location: Romiley
Posts: 13710
I'd make the same observations between my MY08 and previous MY06Steve N | 21MY Defender | 08MY Discovery 3 (history) | 06MY Discovery 3 (ancient history)
26th Apr 2009 12:57 am
Bushwanderer
Member Since: 27 Nov 2007
Location: Northern Rivers, NSW, Australia
Posts: 2050
BB,
Did you get a new remap from BAS for your 2007, or just load on the one for your 2005 model?`The Bearded Dragon
26th Apr 2009 6:56 am
BLACK BETTY
Member Since: 18 Oct 2008
Location: Louth
Posts: 575
I've tried it with BAS on and off and, but no real discernable difference, Pete asked me to check for fault msgs using box , no faults being indicated at all by box
There's a definite difference in power etc, with the 2005 being way far ahead
Next stop LR dealer, but how does one quantify " my newer 4x4 is not as good as my dead 4x4"
anyone else have similar issuesNine-tenths of wisdom is being wise in time.
Member Since: 18 Oct 2008
Location: Louth
Posts: 575
As suspected
' there's nowt wrong wit yer landy'
back to the forum
anyone any more ideas
incidentally
fuel economy has improved alot since I did the mini service on fuel system/ air filter
now returning 32mpg easily, via volume/miles calc
but still have poor performance & smoke
has the turbo set up been changed on the 2007, as it could be that the lag is more noted on the 2007
Marcon:
how does your compare?Nine-tenths of wisdom is being wise in time.
Member Since: 12 Jan 2009
Location: N Yorks
Posts: 1612
My suggestion which probably isn't worth a lot, check very carefully for air leaks on the intercooler hoses if you're making smoke this could be the cause. Also check the intercooler for any small damage. Be really thorough.
I don't think it should smoke but then I've got an 05
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1st May 2009 9:37 am
stapldm
Member Since: 11 Sep 2006
Location: Swine Town
Posts: 2330
BLACK BETTY wrote:
has the turbo set up been changed on the 2007, as it could be that the lag is more noted on the 2007
I test drove the 2006 before buying a 2007; the lag was noticeable less on the 2007...as to smoke; never noticed any except when really booting it hard. My block pave behind the exhausts is raised and only 4" from the pipes, yet there's no sign of soot build up or any other colour difference after 2.5 years.
I think my first suggestion would be to open a bottle of Poteen and see if you can attract TFC over to you; your car sounds like it needs a real expert and you'd struggle to find better.
Otherwise, I thought the following. Some of these may not be advised; I hope other members will jump in to say so.
Somewhere someone on here gave suggestions as to how to exercise the variable vanes in the turbo (Disko_Mikey?) - perhaps this would be worth a shot?
This guide looks like it covers some of the bases too : http://www.btnturbo.com/spindoctor/?id=5 and select Black exhaust smoke; have you checked the intake pipe fittings are all secured properly with the jubilee clips etc?
If you have a leaky turbo (and they all leak some oil from the bearings whilst in use), then over time the intercooler can become obstructed with the collected oil and under high airflow some of the oil can be atomised and dragged into the engine, causing overfueling/air starvation symptoms. Does anyone know if the D3 has an intercooler drain valve?
I seem to recall some old advice on using an old washing up liquid bottle to squirt small quantities of soapy water over the hoses/connectors/intercooler to look for air leaks; I seem to recall this is done with a (very trusted!) assistant in the drivers seat standing on the foot brake and with the park brake on whilst gently holding low-to-medium revs whilst in reverse gear (so if it all goes Pete Tong the car rushes away from you); easier on an auto. Obviously let the engine recover for at least 5 minutes after each 30 second trial to allow the clutch/gearbox/engine coolers to do their thing; this is a great way to cook an auto-box/clutch if you don't do it in short bursts.
I say the above because you need a way of creating a boost condition before you can do this kind of test, and I can't think how else you would do it. It's how I found a split air pipe on my old Volvo.
Leaks show up as foam being created on any leaks after the turbo. Keep water quantity low on the pipes before the turbo in case you have a leak somewhere between the mass air meter and the turbo; you don't want impeller damage by water droplets hitting the vanes.
If you try something like this, it may be safer on a chassis hoist with all 4 wheels off the ground and just get someone to accelerate and brake at the same time...Dr. Ian Malcolm:
"Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should."
Transgenic tomato anyone?
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